What is your belief in God?

YeshuaBought

RickeyD said:

@YeshuaBought ; Stop masquerading as a "Gay Christian." This is deceit. You insult the Holy Spirit.

Reported, leave me alone. You don't have the right to harass me.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD If the source that says that the Bible is right, then how is that a valid source if all the others also say that they are right?

How can you claim to know the future when other sources also claim they can?

Happy_Killbot

@YeshuaBought If you can not prove, either for or against something, then why should we just accept it on truth?

We can not prove for or against there being fairies or leprechauns, should we just accept these things as true and if so why?

YeshuaBought

Happy_Killbot said:

@YeshuaBought If you can not prove, either for or against something, then why should we just accept it on truth?

We can not prove for or against there being fairies or leprechauns, should we just accept these things as true and if so why?

What I mean is, i cannot prove it to you. i am satified, with the level of evidence, that I consider to be available Also, if our resident harasser does not leave me alone, i will really pop off. i am so done with everything.

Happy_Killbot

RickeyD said:

@YeshuaBought ; If you're a practicing lesbian you are NOT a Christian and you are lying to everyone in this forum and you're making a mockery of God's Truth...this is not wise.

But what makes this true? How do we know that this is the case, and you don't have it backwards for instance?

Isn't it possible that only homosexuals go to heaven?

Why should we believe one is true?

If it is just because it is in the bible, that can be re-written and changed in the past.

YeshuaBought

Happy_Killbot said:

RickeyD said:

@YeshuaBought ; If you're a practicing lesbian you are NOT a Christian and you are lying to everyone in this forum and you're making a mockery of God's Truth...this is not wise.

But what makes this true? How do we know that this is the case, and you don't have it backwards for instance?

Isn't it possible that only homosexuals go to heaven?

Why should we believe one is true?

If it is just because it is in the bible, that can be re-written and changed in the past.

You make some good points. I am still too P'd off to deal with him. He needs to respect my bounderies. No one has the right to force their opinion, on other people, this is not a right.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; Believe whatever you desire...I have told you Truth. You are culpable to God and I have done what I've been commanded to do.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD ;RickeyD said:

@Happy_Killbot ; Believe whatever you desire...I have told you Truth. You are culpable to God and I have done what I've been commanded to do.

How can you say this is the truth, when you can't prove or disprove it or other religions?

What if you are wrong?

YeshuaBought

Happy_Killbot said:

@RickeyD ;RickeyD said:

@Happy_Killbot ; Believe whatever you desire...I have told you Truth. You are culpable to God and I have done what I've been commanded to do.

How can you say this is the truth, when you can't prove or disprove it or other religions?

What if you are wrong?

Would you like to know what is sad? I am a born again Christian, but some Christians have pushed me almost to suicide, over my prochoice beliefs, and tolerance of the LGBTQI+ community. i don't think this is what Jesus is intended. i am still absolutely certain of jesus, but some Christians can kiss my ***! Hey listen, thanks for challenging this guy, as he needs to be more tolerant. I am going to take a break, as our resident bigot's behavior is making me feel unsafe, and I am tempted to hurt myself. I promise you, this is not what Jesus is like. Jesus, is the God of love. if people love Him, they will obey Him. Before I take my break, i am promising you that I will get help, if I think things will get worse. All of the hate in this world is driving up the suicide rate. it is just not worth it. Take care.

MayCaesar

@YeshuaBought

Look for people who appreciate you for who you are and will support you, and ignore the haters. It is the only way to live a happy and fulfilling social life. And you do need that social life: life is a complicated route, and you have to have someone on your side to have a high chance of successfully navigating it.

Do not pay attention to people telling you what to do. You are the only authority in your life, and you should stick with what you think is best for you and ignore those who tell you otherwise.

Happy_Killbot

@YeshuaBought I have politely asked @RickeyD to leave you alone, if he gives you any more hate let me know.

Plaffelvohfen

@Happy_Killbot

This guy should be banned... His toxic rhetoric is harmful to some people, and can be very consequential... Sure, the 1st but damn...

Happy_Killbot

@Plaffelvohfen I don't know, this is kind of borderline. I don't think this would survive in court though, but I wouldn't want someone to get hurt because someone was being rude online.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; All religion is "wrong."

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD Christianity is a broad category of religions. If you are trying to make a semantic argument, I couldn't care less.

No one wins when semantics are debated.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot 1) Who do you think you are, atheist, threatening me on the message board?

2) Christianity is NOT a broad category of religions...you're ignorant.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD Look, the law is the law, and cyberbulling and online harassment are crimes. If you keep harassing people, then it is my duty as an American Citizen to ensure that criminals are brought to justice, so that further damage can be avoided.

Christianity has many sects and denominations, which is expected because of how prominent it is.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; There is NOTHING "rude" about the Truth. This is a debate forum and @YeshuaBought is lying or is eternally in error. Hate is tolerating a lie that culminates in death of the soul in Hell. I am telling @YeshuaBought the Truth according to Scripture. She does NOT want to know the Truth.

Yes, God the Father is the epitome of LOVE but He is also absolute Truth, Justice, Holiness, Righteousness and the unrepentant homosexual-lesbian will NOT enter the Kingdom of God; therefore, knowing this truth and saying nothing is "hate"...not love.

"And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires." Galatians 5:24

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot No one is harassing...we are debating and I am responding. If you snowflakes are too weak and hate the Truth to such an extent that you can't take what you dish-out...go find another forum to bully those willing to bow to your insanity. I am here to stand for Truth...if you can't handle the Truth, stop acknowledging me.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD You might think you are telling her the truth, but as I pressed earlier, you have to prove that it is the truth before you can say that it is. Until then it is just speculation, or a theory.

Where is the evidence to support your assumption that God the Father is the epitome of LOVE but He is also absolute Truth, Justice, Holiness, Righteousness and the unrepentant homosexual-lesbian will NOT enter the Kingdom of God?

How do you know that?

MayCaesar

@RickeyD

Truth is derived from logic, not from texts or fantasy stories. You have yet to justify that what you are saying is truth - and no, ancient book references are not a justification. You have to use logic to justify that, which you have failed to do on numerous occasions.

Regardless of whether what you say is truth or not, bullying those who disagree with you is not the way to advance your position. If you want @YeshuaBought to agree with you, then make your argument compelling to her. Simply accusing her of things and telling her to repent is not going to be effective.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; I told you but you do not listen. The Scriptures are clear...the one who practices sin is NOT of God but of the Devil. If one can live in wilful sin, they are NOT "born again" by the Spirit of God...the Scriptures via the Holy Spirit clearly tell you this!

"No one who remains in Him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has seen Him or known Him."  1 John 3:6

"By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments." 1 John 2:3

"For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome,"  1 John 5:3

"If you keep My commandments, you will remain in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and remain in His love."  John 15:10

"If anyone says, "I know Him," but does not keep His commandments, he is a , and the truth is not in him."  1 John 2:4

"By this we know that we remain in Him, and He in us: He has given us of His Spirit."  1 John 4:13

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD Seems to me you are the one with an axe to grind here, specifically against homosexuals and other members of the LGBTQ+ community. The bible teaches that you should forgive your enemies, but you seem hell-bent on keeping them from being the people they want to be.

There are tons of Christian only forums on the internet where you can discuss Jesus to your hearts content.

If the bible is truth, can you prove it to me?

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; If your homosexuality is important and precious to you...don't debate it. I am not a Christian who is fearful to tell you the Truth. If you do not repent/STOP living in sexual immorality and turn to Jesus Christ as Lord for the mediation of your sins, you will die in Hell without remedy...this is Truth!  If that upsets you, that's YOUR problem but I will tell you the Truth from Scripture. Live with it or not...but don't blame me for standing for the Truth of Scripture. Don't be an atheistic hypocrite/snowflake.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD First off, I am not homosexual. I am defending the values of liberalism and the rights of freedom that our founding fathers built this nation on. By not accepting people for who they are, you piss on the graves of those who died to protect it.

You want very hard to believe that you know the truth, yet you do not defend it from reason, you defend it from dogma.

If something is "truth" because someone says so, then why can't we justify anything we have not explicitly disproven?

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; If you're not homosexual, have you not represented yourself as same in other threads? Our Founding Fathers also placed the freedom of speech at the head of the Bill of Rights. You suggest I should be "imprisoned" for speaking the Truth of Scripture...simply because a lost and dying and spiritually ignorant atheist does not believe or know the Truth of Scripture does not negate the veracity and Truth of same. You're an atheistic hypocrite!

You don't know Truth because you are servant of Satan and you believe and live his lies. Prove me wrong, atheist.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD If I have represented that I was homosexual, it was not intentional.

Now I am not saying you can not say what you please, but remember that freedom of speech works both ways.

You say something, I say something back. You say something dumb, bigoted or dogmatic, I call you out on it.

For example, shifting the burden of proof.

In the US, you are innocent until proven guilty. Therefore, if you believe I am a "servant of satan" you must prove it. It is not my duty to disprove it.

And in order to prove it, you must first show evidence that satan exists. Ill be waiting.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; Due process is irrelevant concerning Biblical Truth. In this life constrained by Time, you're either a servant of God or a servant of Satan ("the prince of the power of the air"). You have chosen to serve Satan by default having rejected Jesus as Lord. This is your choice and you will reap what you sow for same lest you repent!

smoothie

I repent RickeyD and accept basic logic and common sense as my lord and savior

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD Where does it say in the bible that due process should be ignored?

Should we just ignore due process and all the evidence in your up-coming trial?

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; Due process, relevant to the Bible, will be administered at your judgment in Eternity.  This is but one reason our Creator has written His moral law on your heart at conception. Due process is irrelevant in substantiating Biblical Truth that you are spiritually dead and a servant of Satan. The evidence for this is adequately displayed by your worldview, your atheism, your spiritual ignorance. Jesus said that the faithful would know you by your works, your words, your deeds.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD ;

If there is no due process, then that means:

RickeyD is a servant of Satan! The evidence is apparent in his lack of Christian ethics, inability to have reasonable discussion, and harassment of others!

would be a perfectly viable statement, and this would stand in the afterlife when you are judged and set to hell for corrupting the words of the bible for your own personal gain.

Of course, there is no evidence for an afterlife, so you are probably safe being an a-hole, at least until you land a one way trip to the slammer.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; Prove it...use any source available.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot Prove there is no afterlife, prove Jesus is lying.

TKDB

@Kiki101

Being non Religious is completely voluntary.

Just as being Religious is completely voluntary as well.

I believe that some of Humanity could be less inhumane towards themselves or to the others around them.

I also believe that Humanity has the ability to create, but is abusing that tool of creation, via the plethora of crimes, that the billions of people commit, against others on a global basis.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD ;

The Bible says so! It's in the book I just wrote that was divinely inspired!

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; You don't know God and you don't know His Truth...you mock that of which you're ignorant and an enemy. You should be careful but you're too foolish and proud.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD The book of bots has me covered again.

RickeyD

  @Happy_Killbot ; Whatever. Enjoy your evening, atheist.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD Putting you in your place has certainly made my evening, it is my guilty pleasure to put fanatics away, among the other childish things where they belong.

MayCaesar

@RickeyD

There is no "His Truth". There is no "someone's truth", there is just truth. Nobody is an authority on what truth is; truth is what it is, and it is derived from the rules of logic, not from someone's opinion.

You are operating with terms you do not understand, terms that your Bible defines, but that differ from the way the English language works.

smoothie

RickeyD said:

@Happy_Killbot ; Prove it...use any source available.

The burden of proof lies on you... you spout your "truth" all the time, learn to back it up. It seems you cannot gather any evidence that isn't random quotes from a book that invents a reality based on faith. What a shocker.

Your religion is not factual. It is pure faith and not factual "truth" of our reality. Do not advertise it as such or it is fallacy.

Dee

@Kiki101


****** This is where you use the god-given ability

Whats a god?    Wheres your proof for such?   Which of of the thousands of proposed gods do you believe and why do you dismiss the others if you do?

 ****. So whigh religion narrows down to you?

None , they are all the same bunk in a different guise BTW Atheism is not a religion 

RickeyD

@smoothie ; I have no burden...I am saved and secure in Jesus Christ. It's you that is headed to a death in sin and Hell...you have a great burden.

Question: “Is there an argument for the existence of God?”

Answer: The question of whether there is a conclusive argument for the existence of God has been debated throughout history, with exceedingly intelligent people taking both sides of the dispute. In recent times, arguments against the possibility of God’s existence have taken on a militant spirit that accuses anyone daring to believe in God as being delusional and irrational. Karl Marx asserted that anyone believing in God must have a mental disorder that caused invalid thinking. The psychiatrist Sigmund Freud wrote that a person who believed in a Creator God was delusional and only held those beliefs due to a “wish-fulfillment” factor that produced what Freud considered to be an unjustifiable position. The philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche bluntly said that faith equates to not wanting to know what is true. The voices of these three figures from history (along with others) are simply now parroted by a new generation of atheists who claim that a belief in God is intellectually unwarranted.

Is this truly the case? Is belief in God a rationally unacceptable position to hold? Is there a logical and reasonable argument for the existence of God? Outside of referencing the Bible, can a case for the existence of God be made that refutes the positions of both the old and new atheists and gives sufficient warrant for believing in a Creator? The answer is, yes, it can. Moreover, in demonstrating the validity of an argument for the existence of God, the case for atheism is shown to be intellectually weak.

An argument for the existence of God — something rather than nothing

To make an argument for the existence of God, we must start by asking the right questions. We begin with the most basic metaphysical question: “Why do we have something rather than nothing at all?” This is the basic question of existence—why are we here; why is the earth here; why is the universe here rather than nothing? Commenting on this point, one theologian has said, “In one sense man does not ask the question about God, his very existence raises the question about God.”

In considering this question, there are four possible answers to why we have something rather than nothing at all:

1. Reality is an illusion.
2. Reality is/was self-created.
3. Reality is self-existent (eternal).
4. Reality was created by something that is self-existent.

So, which is the most plausible solution? Let’s begin with reality being simply an illusion, which is what a number of Eastern religions believe. This option was ruled out centuries ago by the philosopher Rene Descartes who is famous for the statement, “I think, therefore I am.” Descartes, a mathematician, argued that if he is thinking, then he must “be.” In other words, “I think, therefore I am not an illusion.” Illusions require something experiencing the illusion, and moreover, you cannot doubt the existence of yourself without proving your existence; it is a self-defeating argument. So the possibility of reality being an illusion is eliminated.

Next is the option of reality being self-created. When we study philosophy, we learn of “analytically false” statements, which means they are false by definition. The possibility of reality being self-created is one of those types of statements for the simple reason that something cannot be prior to itself. If you created yourself, then you must have existed prior to you creating yourself, but that simply cannot be. In evolution this is sometimes referred to as “spontaneous generation” —something coming from nothing—a position that few, if any, reasonable people hold to anymore simply because you cannot get something from nothing. Even the atheist David Hume said, “I never asserted so absurd a proposition as that anything might arise without a cause.” Since something cannot come from nothing, the alternative of reality being self-created is ruled out.

Now we are left with only two choices—an eternal reality or reality being created by something that is eternal: an eternal universe or an eternal Creator. The 18th-century theologian Jonathan Edwards summed up this crossroads:

• Something exists.
• Nothing cannot create something.
• Therefore, a necessary and eternal “something” exists.

Notice that we must go back to an eternal “something.” The atheist who derides the believer in God for believing in an eternal Creator must turn around and embrace an eternal universe; it is the only other door he can choose. But the question now is, where does the evidence lead? Does the evidence point to matter before mind or mind before matter?

To date, all key scientific and philosophical evidence points away from an eternal universe and toward an eternal Creator. From a scientific standpoint, honest scientists admit the universe had a beginning, and whatever has a beginning is not eternal. In other words, whatever has a beginning has a cause, and if the universe had a beginning, it had a cause. The fact that the universe had a beginning is underscored by evidence such as the second law of thermodynamics, the radiation echo of the big bang discovered in the early 1900s, the fact that the universe is expanding and can be traced back to a singular beginning, and Einstein’s theory of relativity. All prove the universe is not eternal.

Further, the laws that surround causation speak against the universe being the ultimate cause of all we know for this simple fact: an effect must resemble its cause. This being true, no atheist can explain how an impersonal, purposeless, meaningless, and amoral universe accidentally created beings (us) who are full of personality and obsessed with purpose, meaning, and morals. Such a thing, from a causation standpoint, completely refutes the idea of a natural universe birthing everything that exists. So in the end, the concept of an eternal universe is eliminated.

Philosopher J. S. Mill (not a Christian) summed up where we have now come to: “It is self-evident that only Mind can create mind.” The only rational and reasonable conclusion is that an eternal Creator is the one who is responsible for reality as we know it. Or to put it in a logical set of statements:

• Something exists.
• You do not get something from nothing.
• Therefore a necessary and eternal “something” exists.
• The only two options are an eternal universe and an eternal Creator.
• Science and philosophy have disproven the concept of an eternal universe.
• Therefore, an eternal Creator exists.

Former atheist Lee Strobel, who arrived at this end result many years ago, has commented, “Essentially, I realized that to stay an atheist, I would have to believe that nothing produces everything; non-life produces life; randomness produces fine-tuning; chaos produces information; unconsciousness produces consciousness; and non-reason produces reason. Those leaps of faith were simply too big for me to take, especially in light of the affirmative case for God’s existence … In other words, in my assessment the Christian worldview accounted for the totality of the evidence much better than the atheistic worldview.”

An argument for the existence of God — knowing the Creator

But the next question we must tackle is this: if an eternal Creator exists (and we have shown that He does), what kind of Creator is He? Can we infer things about Him from what He created? In other words, can we understand the cause by its effects? The answer to this is yes, we can, with the following characteristics being surmised:

• He must be supernatural in nature (as He created time and space).
• He must be powerful (exceedingly).
• He must be eternal (self-existent).
• He must be omnipresent (He created space and is not limited by it).
• He must be timeless and changeless (He created time).
• He must be immaterial because He transcends space/physical.
• He must be personal (the impersonal cannot create personality).
• He must be infinite and singular as you cannot have two infinites.
• He must be diverse yet have unity as unity and diversity exist in nature.
• He must be intelligent (supremely). Only cognitive being can produce cognitive being.
• He must be purposeful as He deliberately created everything.
• He must be moral (no moral law can be had without a giver).
• He must be caring (or no moral laws would have been given).

These things being true, we now ask if any religion in the world describes such a Creator. The answer to this is yes: the God of the Bible fits this profile perfectly. He is supernatural (Genesis 1:1), powerful (Jeremiah 32:17), eternal (Psalm 90:2), omnipresent (Psalm 139:7), timeless/changeless (Malachi 3:6), immaterial (John 5:24), personal (Genesis 3:9), necessary (Colossians 1:17), infinite/singular (Jeremiah 23:24, Deuteronomy 6:4), diverse yet with unity (Matthew 28:19), intelligent (Psalm 147:4-5), purposeful (Jeremiah 29:11), moral (Daniel 9:14), and caring (1 Peter 5:6-7).

An argument for the existence of God — the flaws of atheism

One last subject to address on the matter of God’s existence is the matter of how justifiable the atheist’s position actually is. Since the atheist asserts the believer’s position is unsound, it is only reasonable to turn the question around and aim it squarely back at him. The first thing to understand is that the claim the atheist makes—“no god,” which is what “atheist” means—is an untenable position to hold from a philosophical standpoint. As legal scholar and philosopher Mortimer Adler says, “An affirmative existential proposition can be proved, but a negative existential proposition—one that denies the existence of something—cannot be proved.” For example, someone may claim that a red eagle exists and someone else may assert that red eagles do not exist. The former only needs to find a single red eagle to prove his assertion. But the latter must comb the entire universe and literally be in every place at once to ensure he has not missed a red eagle somewhere and at some time, which is impossible to do. This is why intellectually honest atheists will admit they cannot prove God does not exist.

Next, it is important to understand the issue that surrounds the seriousness of truth claims that are made and the amount of evidence required to warrant certain conclusions. For example, if someone puts two containers of lemonade in front of you and says that one may be more tart than the other, since the consequences of getting the more tart drink would not be serious, you would not require a large amount of evidence in order to make your choice. However, if to one cup the host added sweetener but to the other he introduced rat poison, then you would want to have quite a bit of evidence before you made your choice.

This is where a person sits when deciding between atheism and belief in God. Since belief in atheism could possibly result in irreparable and eternal consequences, it would seem that the atheist should be mandated to produce weighty and overriding evidence to support his position, but he cannot. Atheism simply cannot meet the test for evidence for the seriousness of the charge it makes. Instead, the atheist and those whom he convinces of his position slide into eternity with their fingers crossed and hope they do not find the unpleasant truth that eternity does indeed exist. As Mortimer Adler says, “More consequences for life and action follow from the affirmation or denial of God than from any other basic question.”

An argument for the existence of God — the conclusion

So does belief in God have intellectual warrant? Is there a rational, logical, and reasonable argument for the existence of God? Absolutely. While atheists such as Freud claim that those believing in God have a wish-fulfillment desire, perhaps it is Freud and his followers who actually suffer from wish-fulfillment: the hope and wish that there is no God, no accountability, and therefore no judgment. But refuting Freud is the God of the Bible who affirms His existence and the fact that a judgment is indeed coming for those who know within themselves the truth that He exists but suppress that truth (Romans 1:20). But for those who respond to the evidence that a Creator does indeed exist, He offers the way of salvation that has been accomplished through His Son, Jesus Christ: “But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God” (John 1:12-13).

https://rickeyholtsclaw.com/2020/01/24/argument-for-the-existence-of-god/

YeshuaBought

smoothie said:

RickeyD said:

@Happy_Killbot ; Prove it...use any source available.

The burden of proof lies on you... you spout your "truth" all the time, learn to back it up. It seems you cannot gather any evidence that isn't random quotes from a book that invents a reality based on faith. What a shocker.

Your religion is not factual. It is pure faith and not factual "truth" of our reality. Do not advertise it as such or it is fallacy.

What kind of proof, would you like to have? i won't make any promises, expect to treat you with respect.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD All of these arguments were proven wrong like, 50 years or more ago. Why do theists still think they are relevant?

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; Prove there is no God.

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD Shift the burden of proof.

RickeyD

@Happy_Killbot ; Obfuscation much? Prove there is no God...you're the one headed to Hell...so if you're so sure that I'm wrong and atheism is right...prove it!

Happy_Killbot

@RickeyD I wonder... can you tell me what it is like to be so dumb that you don't see the problem in your thinking?

If I have to prove god doesn't exist, then what about the other god, gods, and other magical beings? Can you disprove them?