If you believed God asked you to kill someone would you do it?

RickeyHoltsclaw

MayCaesar said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

I am deeply saddened by his failure. Poor omnipotent Elohim...

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Factfinder

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

What other "religious texts" explicitly articulate the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning the creation of the Heavens and the Earth, the complex human genome but the Canon of Scripture?

The 'cannon of scripture' does not 'articulate' anything of the sort. "God did it" is meaningless that requires no articulation. Articulate in your words (Not your books or faith) the complex human gnome and the creation steps involved.

@Factfinder ; Elohim explains the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning our Creation and its purpose.

Nope. You said "explicitly articulates" the complex human gnome. Now I know you don't know it and can't "explicitly articulate" the human gnome and the bible doesn't; so explain your lie. Your master knows you lied. Explain yourself.

@MayCaesar ; The human genome was created in the spiritual image of Elohim as the Father, Son and Spirit ("Us" "Our" Genesis 1:26-28) collaborated on Day-6 to create humanity and imparted specific divine communicable attributes into the human genome; this, for Elohim's eschatological purposes going forward.

That is blind faith foolishness, nothing to do with reality or explicitly articulating the human gnome. Your little god fairy is embarrassed by you. Proof positive you're delusional enough to follow this evil blood thirsty command for you from your little fairy book... Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants,

@Factfinder ; My faith is not blind but the product of experiential relevance. My Lord is Holy, Good, Righteous, Faithful, Loving, Merciful, Compassionate. It is your god that evil, blood thirsty and puts to death children...with an emphasis on those in the womb.

I do not have a desire to kill. Your god admits it does. Your god says to kill babies explicitly. 50% of christians advocate abortion because your master likes to kill babies for glory. It says so in your fairy elf book. You need god so you can pretend you have morals but would kill just because it says to. I won't kill because I have morals. You may have killed already, or not. Fact is you want your god to say kill for my glory and erroneously think you have morals at the same time.

RickeyHoltsclaw

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

What other "religious texts" explicitly articulate the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning the creation of the Heavens and the Earth, the complex human genome but the Canon of Scripture?

The 'cannon of scripture' does not 'articulate' anything of the sort. "God did it" is meaningless that requires no articulation. Articulate in your words (Not your books or faith) the complex human gnome and the creation steps involved.

@Factfinder ; Elohim explains the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning our Creation and its purpose.

Nope. You said "explicitly articulates" the complex human gnome. Now I know you don't know it and can't "explicitly articulate" the human gnome and the bible doesn't; so explain your lie. Your master knows you lied. Explain yourself.

@MayCaesar ; The human genome was created in the spiritual image of Elohim as the Father, Son and Spirit ("Us" "Our" Genesis 1:26-28) collaborated on Day-6 to create humanity and imparted specific divine communicable attributes into the human genome; this, for Elohim's eschatological purposes going forward.

That is blind faith foolishness, nothing to do with reality or explicitly articulating the human gnome. Your little god fairy is embarrassed by you. Proof positive you're delusional enough to follow this evil blood thirsty command for you from your little fairy book... Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants,

@Factfinder ; My faith is not blind but the product of experiential relevance. My Lord is Holy, Good, Righteous, Faithful, Loving, Merciful, Compassionate. It is your god that evil, blood thirsty and puts to death children...with an emphasis on those in the womb.

I do not have a desire to kill. Your god admits it does. Your god says to kill babies explicitly. 50% of christians advocate abortion because your master likes to kill babies for glory. It says so in your fairy elf book. You need god so you can pretend you have morals but would kill just because it says to. I won't kill because I have morals. You may have killed already, or not. Fact is you want your god to say kill for my glory and erroneously think you have morals at the same time.

@Factfinder ; It matters not what your desires are at this time but that by association via your servitude to Satan, every ounce of blood that has been shed through his rebellion is on your hands as well as you'll suffer a fate similar to your spiritual father, Satan (Rev 20:10-15).

Elohim, in the Israeli wars with pagan tribes during their 40-year journey to the Land of Israel, commanded the extinction of those tribes as Elohim, in His omniscience, knew the ramifications of allowing the pagan, defiled, demonic, seed to remain and multiply. Elohim had previously been through the very same heartbreak with the Adamic/Noahic generations who defiled themselves with the demonic thereby thwarting their foreordained mission as progenitors of the Messiah; this, resulting in the extinction of all but eight by water (Genesis 6:5).

Elohim desperately desired that Israel not be defiled by the same demonic seed and wanted these pagan tribes, their progenitors, snuffed out so that the Messiah would enter the Realm of Time through Judah, the Gospel would be presented, Satan would be defeated at Golgotha (1 John 3:8b) and human kind freed from the sentencing of death via the Adamic sin nature.

You argue and spout and blather in spiritual ignorance and hate and animosity in servitude to your god, Satan...you are his fool and every day that passes, you grow closer to the abyss in nihilism and obstinate arrogance.

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/t9/2bo3l3u1stdd.jpg

Factfinder

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

What other "religious texts" explicitly articulate the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning the creation of the Heavens and the Earth, the complex human genome but the Canon of Scripture?

The 'cannon of scripture' does not 'articulate' anything of the sort. "God did it" is meaningless that requires no articulation. Articulate in your words (Not your books or faith) the complex human gnome and the creation steps involved.

@Factfinder ; Elohim explains the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning our Creation and its purpose.

Nope. You said "explicitly articulates" the complex human gnome. Now I know you don't know it and can't "explicitly articulate" the human gnome and the bible doesn't; so explain your lie. Your master knows you lied. Explain yourself.

@MayCaesar ; The human genome was created in the spiritual image of Elohim as the Father, Son and Spirit ("Us" "Our" Genesis 1:26-28) collaborated on Day-6 to create humanity and imparted specific divine communicable attributes into the human genome; this, for Elohim's eschatological purposes going forward.

That is blind faith foolishness, nothing to do with reality or explicitly articulating the human gnome. Your little god fairy is embarrassed by you. Proof positive you're delusional enough to follow this evil blood thirsty command for you from your little fairy book... Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants,

@Factfinder ; My faith is not blind but the product of experiential relevance. My Lord is Holy, Good, Righteous, Faithful, Loving, Merciful, Compassionate. It is your god that evil, blood thirsty and puts to death children...with an emphasis on those in the womb.

I do not have a desire to kill. Your god admits it does. Your god says to kill babies explicitly. 50% of christians advocate abortion because your master likes to kill babies for glory. It says so in your fairy elf book. You need god so you can pretend you have morals but would kill just because it says to. I won't kill because I have morals. You may have killed already, or not. Fact is you want your god to say kill for my glory and erroneously think you have morals at the same time.

@Factfinder ; It matters not what your desires are at this time but that by association via your servitude to Satan, every ounce of blood that has been shed through his rebellion is on your hands as well as you'll suffer a fate similar to your spiritual father, Satan (Rev 20:10-15).

Elohim, in the Israeli wars with pagan tribes during their 40-year journey to the Land of Israel, commanded the extinction of those tribes as Elohim, in His omniscience, knew the ramifications of allowing the pagan, defiled, demonic, seed to remain and multiply. Elohim had previously been through the very same heartbreak with the Adamic/Noahic generations who defiled themselves with the demonic thereby thwarting their foreordained mission as progenitors of the Messiah; this, resulting in the extinction of all but eight by water (Genesis 6:5).

Elohim desperately desired that Israel not be defiled by the same demonic seed and wanted these pagan tribes, their progenitors, snuffed out so that the Messiah would enter the Realm of Time through Judah, the Gospel would be presented, Satan would be defeated at Golgotha (1 John 3:8b) and human kind freed from the sentencing of death via the Adamic sin nature.

You argue and spout and blather in spiritual ignorance and hate and animosity in servitude to your god, Satan...you are his fool and every day that passes, you grow closer to the abyss in nihilism and obstinate arrogance.

So god has to kill women and children to keep hebrews from being defiled? What, did it get tired of simply saying "let there be..."

MayCaesar

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

@Factfinder ; It matters not what your desires are at this time but that by association via your servitude to Satan, every ounce of blood that has been shed through his rebellion is on your hands as well as you'll suffer a fate similar to your spiritual father, Satan (Rev 20:10-15).

See, this is why I have always said that communism is a spiritual successor of Christianity. This concept of being responsible for something someone else has done because you happen to be a part of the same loosely defined collective as them is intrinsic to communism. Just as Stalin or Mao executed people because their grandparents were deemed to be counterrevolutionaries, so does your evil religion advocate for sending people to Hell because some people having a-religiosity in common with them participated in some "rebellion".

Communism, Nationalism, Christianity and Islam... The Four Great Evils (I have coined this term; you are welcome) without which this world would have been a paradise. Everywhere these things came, prosperity and progress were replaced by poverty and rivers of blood - and only when they were pushed away to the outskirts of the society, would civilization thrive again.

I go to my office, and I meet forward-thinking people, inventors of technology and generators of great ideas. Then I open the Internet and go to places like this - and I meet those the purpose of existence of whom is to destroy everything good people created, for in destruction they find the meaning of their life. They want others to suffer - how else can they feel good about their own miserable lives? Everyone must pay their fair share - in blood, preferably.

You are doing God's deed (pun intended), Rickey. The more people read your preaching here and get disgusted by religion, the sooner this world will be free from this medieval stuff. Please keep doing a good work!

Factfinder

@MayCaesar

You are doing God's deed (pun intended), Rickey. The more people read your preaching here and get disgusted by religion, the sooner this world will be free from this medieval stuff. Please keep doing a good work!

Dam I wish I thought of that!

21CenturyIconoclast

@Factfinder

YOUR QUOTE TO THE BIBLE DUNCE RICKEYHOLTSCLAW: "Your god says to kill babies explicitly. 50% of christians advocate abortion because your master likes to kill babies for glory. It says so in your fairy elf book."

Here, let me help you out AGAIN, where it is preferable for you to actually give chapter and verse in the primitive Bible to support your claim:

1. JESUS AS GOD MURDERED hundreds of thousands of INNOCENT zygotes, fetus' and babies in his Great Flood Scenario; "For behold, I will bring a flood of waters upon the earth to destroy all flesh in which is the breath of life under heaven. Everything that is on the earth shall die." (Genesis 6:17)

2. JESUS AS GOD STATED: "The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. And if they give birth, I will slaughter their beloved children. (Hosea 9:11-16)

3. JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS AS GOD STATED: "Happy the man who shall seize and smash your little ones against the rock!" (Psalms 137:9)

4, ESUS AS GOD STATED: “Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.” (Isaiah 13:16)

These are but a FEW OF MANY examples where the serial killing Jesus as god within the scriptures did such dastardly acts to the innocent babies and children, AND YET AT THE SAME TIME, the Jesus character is said to be all loving and forgiving, NOT!

You can thank me later in helping you out again ..................

.

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

RICKEYHOLTSCLAW, do you tell your friends about the Jesus as God shown in the revealing link above, or this link herewith: https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/175973/#Comment_175973?

Or, are you to SCARED to even "try" and tell them about the REAL JESUS with his outright MURDERING modus operandi towards INNOCENT babies and children?

When Jesus as god MURDERS innocent babies and children as shown in said link above, is he still considered ever loving and forgiving when doing so?
BEGIN your answer here:

.

Factfinder

@21CenturyIconoclast

You're right, it's all mythical bullsh*t. Prior to where you quoted me I had pasted 1 Samuel 15:3 to his shame. I chose that one because it specifically mentions killing ALL children and infants god don't like; and that was because he (ricky) erroneously claims secular humanism/atheists corner the market in abortions. A lie of course and I proved that to him as well.

Thanks for helping me out.

RickeyHoltsclaw

@Factfinder ; @21CenturyIconoclast ; @21CenturyIconoclast ; @Factfinder Jesus is Elohim...Jesus is our Creator (Genesis 1:1; John 1; Hebrews 1; Colossians 1). Jesus gave His life for the innocent...Jesus loves babies and children and tells you that the Kingdom of God belongs to them. Jesus does not murder...He gives life. Don't share links...be of sufficient courage to articulate your accusations so they can be rebutted.

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/rd/k929vr5cgxxr.jpg

RickeyHoltsclaw

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

What other "religious texts" explicitly articulate the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning the creation of the Heavens and the Earth, the complex human genome but the Canon of Scripture?

The 'cannon of scripture' does not 'articulate' anything of the sort. "God did it" is meaningless that requires no articulation. Articulate in your words (Not your books or faith) the complex human gnome and the creation steps involved.

@Factfinder ; Elohim explains the who, what, where, when, why, how, concerning our Creation and its purpose.

Nope. You said "explicitly articulates" the complex human gnome. Now I know you don't know it and can't "explicitly articulate" the human gnome and the bible doesn't; so explain your lie. Your master knows you lied. Explain yourself.

@MayCaesar ; The human genome was created in the spiritual image of Elohim as the Father, Son and Spirit ("Us" "Our" Genesis 1:26-28) collaborated on Day-6 to create humanity and imparted specific divine communicable attributes into the human genome; this, for Elohim's eschatological purposes going forward.

That is blind faith foolishness, nothing to do with reality or explicitly articulating the human gnome. Your little god fairy is embarrassed by you. Proof positive you're delusional enough to follow this evil blood thirsty command for you from your little fairy book... Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants,

@Factfinder ; My faith is not blind but the product of experiential relevance. My Lord is Holy, Good, Righteous, Faithful, Loving, Merciful, Compassionate. It is your god that evil, blood thirsty and puts to death children...with an emphasis on those in the womb.

I do not have a desire to kill. Your god admits it does. Your god says to kill babies explicitly. 50% of christians advocate abortion because your master likes to kill babies for glory. It says so in your fairy elf book. You need god so you can pretend you have morals but would kill just because it says to. I won't kill because I have morals. You may have killed already, or not. Fact is you want your god to say kill for my glory and erroneously think you have morals at the same time.

@Factfinder ; It matters not what your desires are at this time but that by association via your servitude to Satan, every ounce of blood that has been shed through his rebellion is on your hands as well as you'll suffer a fate similar to your spiritual father, Satan (Rev 20:10-15).

Elohim, in the Israeli wars with pagan tribes during their 40-year journey to the Land of Israel, commanded the extinction of those tribes as Elohim, in His omniscience, knew the ramifications of allowing the pagan, defiled, demonic, seed to remain and multiply. Elohim had previously been through the very same heartbreak with the Adamic/Noahic generations who defiled themselves with the demonic thereby thwarting their foreordained mission as progenitors of the Messiah; this, resulting in the extinction of all but eight by water (Genesis 6:5).

Elohim desperately desired that Israel not be defiled by the same demonic seed and wanted these pagan tribes, their progenitors, snuffed out so that the Messiah would enter the Realm of Time through Judah, the Gospel would be presented, Satan would be defeated at Golgotha (1 John 3:8b) and human kind freed from the sentencing of death via the Adamic sin nature.

You argue and spout and blather in spiritual ignorance and hate and animosity in servitude to your god, Satan...you are his fool and every day that passes, you grow closer to the abyss in nihilism and obstinate arrogance.

So god has to kill women and children to keep hebrews from being defiled? What, did it get tired of simply saying "let there be..."

@Factfinder ; @MayCaesar ; @21CenturyIconoclast ; @ZeusAres42 ; It is the women who birth the children of the demonic seed that war against Israel and seeks to thwart Elohim's eschatological purposes through them. Elohim is a realist and a Warrior...not a virtue signaling sissy leftist...war is war.

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/g2/g691vt77qeb2.jpg

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/5j/lb8nh6nhaxy3.jpg

RickeyHoltsclaw

Factfinder said:

@MayCaesar

You are doing God's deed (pun intended), Rickey. The more people read your preaching here and get disgusted by religion, the sooner this world will be free from this medieval stuff. Please keep doing a good work!

Dam I wish I thought of that!

@MayCaesar ; That's because the overwhelming majority of those "here" are virtue signaling, spiritually ignorant, atheists-democrats-progressives...who don't know Elohim and why they exist within the Realm of Time and why the previous 6000-years of human history have been ravaged by war, famine, suffering, death...they are illiterate fools of spiritual darkness who will perish in Hell in nihilism.

RickeyHoltsclaw

Factfinder said:

@21CenturyIconoclast

You're right, it's all mythical bullsh*t. Prior to where you quoted me I had pasted 1 Samuel 15:3 to his shame. I chose that one because it specifically mentions killing ALL children and infants god don't like; and that was because he (ricky) erroneously claims secular humanism/atheists corner the market in abortions. A lie of course and I proved that to him as well.

Thanks for helping me out.

@Factfinder ; @21CenturyIconclast ; Atheism-Secular Humanists have murdered more babies in America since 1973 than all babies having died in war in history.

Factfinder

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@21CenturyIconoclast

You're right, it's all mythical bullsh*t. Prior to where you quoted me I had pasted 1 Samuel 15:3 to his shame. I chose that one because it specifically mentions killing ALL children and infants god don't like; and that was because he (ricky) erroneously claims secular humanism/atheists corner the market in abortions. A lie of course and I proved that to him as well.

Thanks for helping me out.

@Factfinder ; @21CenturyIconclast ; Atheism-Secular Humanists have murdered more babies in America since 1973 than all babies having died in war in history.

@RickeyHoltsclaw

Why do you lie to yourself? Hitler said he's a christian doing gods work. You know it because you feel the same way. You read the facts and it cuts through your bone marrow like a double edge sword. You and hitler serve the same god. https://inference-review.com/letter/hitlers-christianity

Plan Parenthood founder was...you guessed it! Christian, episcopalian...

Margaret Sanger https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger

Face the facts ricky, your blind faith of an imaginary god found in your fairytale elf god book is the scourge of humanity. When you want to do things like your book commands, like killing babies, you will do it too. Just like these two other 100% true christians. And you know it.

RickeyHoltsclaw

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@21CenturyIconoclast

You're right, it's all mythical bullsh*t. Prior to where you quoted me I had pasted 1 Samuel 15:3 to his shame. I chose that one because it specifically mentions killing ALL children and infants god don't like; and that was because he (ricky) erroneously claims secular humanism/atheists corner the market in abortions. A lie of course and I proved that to him as well.

Thanks for helping me out.

@Factfinder ; @21CenturyIconclast ; Atheism-Secular Humanists have murdered more babies in America since 1973 than all babies having died in war in history.

@RickeyHoltsclaw

Why do you lie to yourself? Hitler said he's a christian doing gods work. You know it because you feel the same way. You read the facts and it cuts through your bone marrow like a double edge sword. You and hitler serve the same god. https://inference-review.com/letter/hitlers-christianity

Plan Parenthood founder was...you guessed it! Christian, episcopalian...
Margaret Sanger https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger

Face the facts ricky, your blind faith of an imaginary god found in your fairytale elf god book is the scourge of humanity. When you want to do things like your book commands, like killing babies, you will do it too. Just like these two other 100% true christians. And you know it.

@Factfinder Christians don't murder babies...that's the arena of your god and your unbelief...you have every ounce of blood of the innocent on your hands as you will stand in judgment for same.

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/vg/4j92ofl6qo8u.jpg

Factfinder

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@21CenturyIconoclast

You're right, it's all mythical bullsh*t. Prior to where you quoted me I had pasted 1 Samuel 15:3 to his shame. I chose that one because it specifically mentions killing ALL children and infants god don't like; and that was because he (ricky) erroneously claims secular humanism/atheists corner the market in abortions. A lie of course and I proved that to him as well.

Thanks for helping me out.

@Factfinder ; @21CenturyIconclast ; Atheism-Secular Humanists have murdered more babies in America since 1973 than all babies having died in war in history.

@RickeyHoltsclaw

Why do you lie to yourself? Hitler said he's a christian doing gods work. You know it because you feel the same way. You read the facts and it cuts through your bone marrow like a double edge sword. You and hitler serve the same god. https://inference-review.com/letter/hitlers-christianity

Plan Parenthood founder was...you guessed it! Christian, episcopalian...
Margaret Sanger https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger

Face the facts ricky, your blind faith of an imaginary god found in your fairytale elf god book is the scourge of humanity. When you want to do things like your book commands, like killing babies, you will do it too. Just like these two other 100% true christians. And you know it.

@Factfinder Christians don't murder babies...that's the arena of your god and your unbelief...you have every ounce of blood of the innocent on your hands as you will stand in judgment for same.

I know. Uncanny how leftist socialists emulate bible hermeneutics so close, ha ricky?

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

RICKEYHOLTSCLAW, THE NUMBER ONE BIBLE FOOL OF THIS RELIGION FORUM, BAR NONE,

YOUR ONCE AGAIN BEFUDDLED QUOTE RELATIVE TO THE ACTUAL JESUS CHARACTER IN THE PRIMITIVE BIBLE: "Jesus is Elohim...Jesus is our Creator (Genesis 1:1; John 1; Hebrews 1; Colossians 1). Jesus gave His life for the innocent...Jesus loves babies and children and tells you that the Kingdom of God belongs to them. Jesus does not murder...He gives life. Don't share links...be of sufficient courage to articulate your accusations so they can be rebutted."
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/175991/#Comment_175991

JESUS DID NOT GIVE HIS LIFE FOR THE INNOCENT!!!

1. Do the simple math, Jesus took a 3 day tomb nap and AROSE and left his tomb to rejoin his disciples as a walking ZOMBIE! Therefore, Jesus WAS NOT A TRUE SACRIFICE as soldiers were in WW2 when they died, THEY REMAINED DEAD! The mythical Jesus only DIED for 3 days, hardly a true sacrifice! DUH!

2. How can the SERIAL KILLER JESUS as god love babies and children, and at the same time, he MURDERED them as shown in this link:
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/175973/#Comment_175973

EXPLAIN, BEGIN:

3. Your 1400 square mile "Kingdom of Heaven" with its 216 depth walls (Revelation 21:16-17) belongs to ALL pseudo-christians like YOU if they have not sinned and were born again, dumb Bible inept pseudo-christian! How dare you say otherwise? But yet, NO ONE, I REPEAT, NO ONE is in heaven at this time because only Jesus as God was there in the first place, and will comically return someday as this verse so states: "No one has ascended into heaven except the one who descended from heaven, the Son of Man." (John 3:13). Do you want to call John a ?

Since when do you speak for all of the membership, where you say not to share links that make you the number one Bible Fool of this religion forum? Huh? I have more courage than you will ever have in you TRYING TO DEFEND your faith, and that you RUN AWAY from as shown in my posts to you!

NEXT PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN LIKE "RICKEYHOLTSCLAW" THAT HAS BLINDED EYES TO ACTUAL BIBLICAL VERSES THAT PROVE HIM BLATANTLY WRONG, WILL BE. ..........?
.

RickeyHoltsclaw

@21CenturyIconoclast

@21CenturyIconoclast ; @Factfinder ; @ZeusAres42 ; @MayCaesar ; John_C_87 @jack

1) Jesus was crucified and rose again in three-days as He told you (Matthew 12:40). Jesus was not a "zombie" but displayed His resurrected body just as the body the redeemed by faith will receive (Philippians 3:21).

2) Jesus murdered no one...Elohim gave directives in the Old Testament wars between Israel's children and pagan tribes for eschatological purposes going forward; namely, for the introduction of Messiah through Judah by which Elohim would fulfill His promise to Abraham (Genesis 12:3b) through Gospel and the Great Commission. Elohim's harsh orders during Israel's journey to the land promised Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were in response to Elohim's desire that Israel NOT repeat the failures of the Adamic/Noahic generations and their compromise with paganism, the demonic seed (Genesis 6:5), that thwarted those generations as progenitors of Messiah who would enter the Realm of Time specifically "to destroy the works of the Devil" for you and for me (1 John 3:8b); this, via a Gospel that was ordained "before Time began" (2 Timothy 1:8-10).

3) Jesus gave His life for the innocent (children and those made righteous through faith in the Old Testament) and for the guilty sinner (Romans 5:8-9) as Jesus lived in perfection and obedience to both the spiritual and codified laws (Matthew 5:17; John 8:46) and Jesus walked to the horrors of a Roman Crucifixion and shed His innocent blood (1 Peter 1:18-19) as per the mandates of Leviticus 17:11 and the Father looked at the blood of His dear Son dripping into the sands of Golgotha below the Cross and declared that blood as acceptable atonement for our sin (Matthew 26:28; John 3:16); the Father has agreed via New Covenant promise that anyone who trusts in Messiah Jesus as atonement for their sin, the Father will impute-gift the righteousness of Jesus over the life of the one who so believes (2 Corinthians 5:21); this, in exchange for their sin-debt and the Father will declare them "not guilty" as per New Covenant promise (Hebrews 8:12; 10; Ezekiel 36; Jeremiah 31); then, the Father promises to provide the indwelling Holy Spirit as Guarantor of that New Covenant with Him, forever (Ephesians 1:13-14; John 14:26).

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/5w/wkh3c6mi0z6y.jpg

Factfinder

@RickeyHoltsclaw

The word of god...

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

You're on the same path as hitler. And you know it.

RickeyHoltsclaw

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

The word of god...

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

You're on the same path as hitler. And you know it.

@Factfinder ; No...you're in bed with Hitler as you both serve the same god and you'll both suffer a similar fate as your god (Revelation 20:10).

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/rj/e28cf9vxpuom.jpg

Factfinder

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

The word of god...

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

You're on the same path as hitler. And you know it.

@Factfinder ; No...you're in bed with Hitler as you both serve the same god and you'll both suffer a similar fate as your god (Revelation 20:10).

I serve no god so I can't serve the same god you two do. For one I have morals. You admit you don't have morals without god and have only done the bad things god allows, like baby killing and bigotry, only when it tells you guys to do those things.

RickeyHoltsclaw

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

The word of god...

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

You're on the same path as hitler. And you know it.

@Factfinder ; No...you're in bed with Hitler as you both serve the same god and you'll both suffer a similar fate as your god (Revelation 20:10).

I serve no god so I can't serve the same god you two do. For one I have morals. You admit you don't have morals without god and have only done the bad things god allows, like baby killing and bigotry, only when it tells you guys to do those things.

@Factfinder ; You serve Satan unaware...you are his servant (John 8:44). Your morals result from your fear of reprisal and societal shame your arrogance and concerns over perceptions... My morals emanate from the indwelling Holy Spirit who has enlivened the Spiritual Law written upon my heart and mated same with the redeemed conscience provided through faith in Jesus as my Messiah (Hebrews 10; 2 Corinthians 5:17).

It is you that supports an aberrant faction of society and its representatives that advocates for the murder of babies in the womb and for that reason you will stand in the Judgement (Rev 20:10-15) with innocent blood on your hands and your adjudication will be unconscionably severe.

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/3n/21654m0o6fm5.jpg

Factfinder

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

The word of god...

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

You're on the same path as hitler. And you know it.

@Factfinder ; No...you're in bed with Hitler as you both serve the same god and you'll both suffer a similar fate as your god (Revelation 20:10).

I serve no god so I can't serve the same god you two do. For one I have morals. You admit you don't have morals without god and have only done the bad things god allows, like baby killing and bigotry, only when it tells you guys to do those things.

@Factfinder ; You serve Satan unaware...you are his servant (John 8:44). Your morals result from your fear of reprisal and societal shame your arrogance and concerns over perceptions... My morals emanate from the indwelling Holy Spirit who has enlivened the Spiritual Law written upon my heart and mated same with the redeemed conscience provided through faith in Jesus as my Messiah (Hebrews 10; 2 Corinthians 5:17).

It is you that supports an aberrant faction of society and its representatives that advocates for the murder of babies in the womb and for that reason you will stand in the Judgement (Rev 20:10-15) with innocent blood on your hands and your adjudication will be unconscionably severe.

My morals are mine. Yours are non existent as you again admit you rely on god to tell you what's moral. And biblically, any sadistic act congeable is okay as long as it's done at your fairy's instructions and for its glory.

Ricky, really, it's not that bad losing your faith and gaining reality in its place. Everything you've posted has been thoroughly debunked. You know it. Why share the exact same delusional faith as hitler? Come home to reason, logic and critical thinking. Release that albatross that's around your neck. You know with each defeat you lose bits and pieces of your faith anyway.

21CenturyIconoclast

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

@Factfinder ; @21CenturyIconoclast ; @21CenturyIconoclast ; @Factfinder Jesus is Elohim...Jesus is our Creator (Genesis 1:1; John 1; Hebrews 1; Colossians 1). Jesus gave His life for the innocent...Jesus loves babies and children and tells you that the Kingdom of God belongs to them. Jesus does not murder...He gives life. Don't share links...be of sufficient courage to articulate your accusations so they can be rebutted.

RICKEYHOLTSCLAW, THE NUMBER ONE BIBLE FOOL OF THIS RELIGION FORUM, BAR NONE,

YOUR BIBLE INEPTNESS QUOTE AT YOUR EMBARRASSING EXPENSE!!!!: "Jesus does not murder."

When dealing with your superiors like myself and others upon your despicable primitive Bronze and Iron Age Bible, please, take your pointed aluminum hat off before you try and refute our adult knowledge of the Bible over your pre-school knowledge of same, agreed? Thank you in advance next time.

You are having a very hard time in accepting actual Biblical axioms, therefore at your laughable expense AGAIN, I will school you AGAIN upon this topic in front of the membership where IN FACT JESUS IS A SERIAL KILLER OF HIS JEWISH CREATION!

HERE IS YOUR BIBLE TUTORIAL FOR TODAY:

1. BIBLE SAYS THERE IS ONLY ONE GOD: "For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” (1 Timothy 2:5)

2. JESUS IS GOD: “Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours.” (2 Peter 1:1)

3. YOU ARE TO FOLLOW JESUS' WORDS: "But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.” (Matthew 4:4)

4. EVERY WORD OF JESUS AS GOD IS TRUE: “EVERY word of God is flawless; he is a shield to those who take refuge in him.“ (Proverbs 30:5)

Therefore, since the above biblical axioms CANNOT BE REFUTED BY YOU BEING A BIBLE FOOL TO BEGIN WITH AS CONTINUALLY SHOWN, then the following GODLY ACTIONS are attributed to none other than JESUS AS GOD, PERIOD! 2+2=4!

A. JESUS SAID: "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death. (Matthew 15: 3-4).

The “command” that Jesus was referring too and that was in effect at His time, and forever to this day, was when Moses said: “Honor your father and mother,' and, 'Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.” (Exodus 21:17)

Explain how you have to accept Jesus as God says that any parents offspring that curse them are to be MURDERED in Jesus' name?

BEGIN:

B. JESUS' WORDS AS GOD TO FOLLOW IF A WIFE IS NOT A VIRGIN UPON MARRIAGE: “But if the thing is true, and evidences of virginity are not found for the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father’s house, AND THE MEN OF HER CITY SHALL STONE HER TO DEATH WITH STONES, because she has done a disgraceful thing in Israel, to play the harlot in her father’s house. So you shall put away the evil from among you.” (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)

Explain how you have to accept Jesus as God saying that a woman that is not a virgin upon her marriage is to be MURDERED?

BEGIN:

C. JESUS AS GOD SHOWS HIMSELF TO BE A BRUTAL ABORTIONIST!!!: “The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for their children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered oh Lord. what should I request for your people? I will ask for the wombs that don’t give birth and breast that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. AND IF THEY GIVE BIRTH, I WILL SLAUGTER THEIR BELOVED CHILDREN (Hosea 9:11-16)

RICKEY, if you ever protest an abortion clinic in any way, and as shown above with your Jesus as God being an outright ABORTIONIST, then you will be a SATANIC HYPOCRITE, GET IT?!

Explain how you have to accept Jesus as God being an ABORTIONIST of innocent zygotes, fetus' and where Jesus will SLAUGHTER innocent babies if they were born?

BEGIN:

These are but a FEW OF MANY disgusting instances of your BRUTAL SERIAL KILLER JESUS that I will be presenting to you, so be prepared, understood?!

21CenturyIconoclast

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

The word of god...

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

You're on the same path as hitler. And you know it.

@Factfinder ; No...you're in bed with Hitler as you both serve the same god and you'll both suffer a similar fate as your god (Revelation 20:10).

I serve no god so I can't serve the same god you two do. For one I have morals. You admit you don't have morals without god and have only done the bad things god allows, like baby killing and bigotry, only when it tells you guys to do those things.

@Factfinder ; You serve Satan unaware...you are his servant (John 8:44). Your morals result from your fear of reprisal and societal shame your arrogance and concerns over perceptions... My morals emanate from the indwelling Holy Spirit who has enlivened the Spiritual Law written upon my heart and mated same with the redeemed conscience provided through faith in Jesus as my Messiah (Hebrews 10; 2 Corinthians 5:17).

It is you that supports an aberrant faction of society and its representatives that advocates for the murder of babies in the womb and for that reason you will stand in the Judgement (Rev 20:10-15) with innocent blood on your hands and your adjudication will be unconscionably severe.

YOUR HYPOCRITICAL QUOTE ONCE AGAIN SHOWN ABOVE RELATIVE TO YOUR ABORTIONIST JESUS AS GOD!!!: "It is you that supports an aberrant faction of society and its representatives that advocates for the murder of babies in the womb and for that reason you will stand in the Judgement (Rev 20:10-15) with innocent blood on your hands and your adjudication will be unconscionably severe."

OH, oh, once again your biblical ineptness is showing, whereas YOUR GOD JESUS murdered innocent zygotes, fetus' IN THE WOMB that you are against in society that does the same, therefore you are a HYPOCRITE when your YOUR GOD JESUS does the same as an outright ABORTIONIST as explicitly shown in the verse shown herewith below;

"The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for their children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered oh Lord. what should I request for your people? I will ask for the wombs that don’t give birth and breast that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. AND IF THEY GIVE BIRTH, I WILL SLAUGTER THEIR BELOVED CHILDREN (Hosea 9:11-16)

Ewwwwwwww, Explain how you have to accept Jesus as God being an ABORTIONIST of innocent zygotes, fetus,' and where Jesus will SLAUGHTER innocent babies if they were born as shown in Jesus' brutal bloody ways of ABORTION in the disgusting verse above?!!!

BEGIN:

.

John_C_87

GOD ask me to kill many people almost every day... I don't know why though, my choice of death for my victums is old age.

RickeyHoltsclaw

21CenturyIconoclast said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

Factfinder said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

The word of god...

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

You're on the same path as hitler. And you know it.

@Factfinder ; No...you're in bed with Hitler as you both serve the same god and you'll both suffer a similar fate as your god (Revelation 20:10).

I serve no god so I can't serve the same god you two do. For one I have morals. You admit you don't have morals without god and have only done the bad things god allows, like baby killing and bigotry, only when it tells you guys to do those things.

@Factfinder ; You serve Satan unaware...you are his servant (John 8:44). Your morals result from your fear of reprisal and societal shame your arrogance and concerns over perceptions... My morals emanate from the indwelling Holy Spirit who has enlivened the Spiritual Law written upon my heart and mated same with the redeemed conscience provided through faith in Jesus as my Messiah (Hebrews 10; 2 Corinthians 5:17).

It is you that supports an aberrant faction of society and its representatives that advocates for the murder of babies in the womb and for that reason you will stand in the Judgement (Rev 20:10-15) with innocent blood on your hands and your adjudication will be unconscionably severe.

YOUR HYPOCRITICAL QUOTE ONCE AGAIN RELATIVE TO YOUR ABORTIONIST JESUS AS GOD!!!: "It is you that supports an aberrant faction of society and its representatives that advocates for the murder of babies in the womb and for that reason you will stand in the Judgement (Rev 20:10-15) with innocent blood on your hands and your adjudication will be unconscionably severe."

OH, oh, once again your biblical ineptness is showing, whereas YOUR GOD JESUS murdered innocent zygotes, fetus' IN THE WOMB that you are against in society that does the same, therefore you are a HYPOCRITE when your YOUR GOD JESUS does the same as an outright ABORTIONIST as explicitly shown in the verse shown herewith below;

"The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for their children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered oh Lord. what should I request for your people? I will ask for the wombs that don’t give birth and breast that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. AND IF THEY GIVE BIRTH, I WILL SLAUGTER THEIR BELOVED CHILDREN (Hosea 9:11-16)

Ewwwwwwww, Explain how you have to accept Jesus as God being an ABORTIONIST of innocent zygotes, fetus,' and where Jesus will SLAUGHTER innocent babies if they were born as shown in Jesus' brutal bloody ways of ABORTION in the disgusting verse above?!!!

BEGIN:

.

@21CenturyIconoclast ; Jesus does not advocate for the death of babies.

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

.
!!!!!! MEMBERSHIP ALERT !!!!!!

The BIBLE RUNAWAY FOOL "RICKEYHOLTSCLAW" is running away from my post shown below in showing him how utterly sickening Jesus is in being a brutal and bloody ABORTIONIST in this link: https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176042/#Comment_176042 4:54AM

RICKEYS " WIMPY" AND "LYING" RESPONSE TO MY VERY REVEALING POST ABOVE EXPLICITLY SHOWING JESUS IS AN ABORTIONIST: Jesus does not advocate for the death of babies.
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176075/#Comment_176075

Huh? That's it where RICKEY outright LIES as shown in my post in the link above where in the book of Hosea, Jesus is an outright brutal and bloody ABORTIONIST?! We have a RUNNER named RickeyHoltsclaw to the truth within the Bible, just like FACTFINDER!

SIMPLE DEDUCTION: Since Rickey is a coward and a as shown in this post to even try to defend my post in question above, then upon his demise, Jesus as God will send him to HELL!:

“But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.” (Revelation 21:8)

IS THERE ANOTHER PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN LIKE "RICKEYHOLTCLAW" THAT CAN POSSIBLY HELP HIM ACCEPT THAT JESUS IS IN FACT A BRUTAL AND BLOODY ABORTIONIST?

.

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

.
RICKEY, we are still waiting for you to ACCEPT THE FACT that Jesus is an adherent to MURDERING his JEWISH creation as explicitly shown in the link below!
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176042/#Comment_176042

WAITING, don't be a runner like Factfinder!

.

RickeyHoltsclaw

21CenturyIconoclast said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

.
RICKEY, we are still waiting for you to ACCEPT THE FACT that Jesus is an adherent to MURDERING his JEWISH creation as explicitly shown in the link below!
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176042/#Comment_176042

WAITING, don't be a runner like Factfinder!

.

@21CenturyIconoclast ; @Factfinder ; Jesus is a Jew from the Tribe of Judah via the hypostatic union (Philippians 2:6-11)...He was never "an adherent to murdering His Jewish creation" but Jesus was brokenhearted over them due their rejection of the Father's will for their lives and their precious covenants that foreordained the Jew and the Israelite as ministers of the Gospel and the Great Commission (Genesis 12:3b).

Jesus will be faithful to the promises of Elohim concerning Israel's children and a remnant of Israel's children will be saved through faith in Yeshua during the Tribulation era and these will serve Him in the New Jerusalem during the Millennial Kingdom (Zechariah 12:10; Isaiah 10:22; Romans 9:27).

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/bc/1evyhoqs980a.jpg

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/lp/z4epvc43ptni.jpg

RickeyHoltsclaw

@21CenturyIconoclast @21CenturyIconoclast ; Jesus was not a proponent of abortion, infanticide. Jesus came to provide life, not extinguish it. Jesus created life (Genesis 1; John 1; Hebrews 1; Colossians 1) and Jesus died to provide the opportunity for eternal life to all who believe in Him as Messiah as Jesus came to destroy the works of the Devil...the "Thief."

Image: https://debateisland.com/uploads/editor/mh/nfwtg72js7nu.jpg

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

YOUR PATHETIC NON-SENSICAL QUOTE RELATIVE TO JESUS AS GOD!!!: "Jesus is a Jew from the Tribe of Judah via the hypostatic union (Philippians 2:6-11)...He was never "an adherent to murdering His Jewish creation"
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176089/#Comment_176089

WRONG AGAIN BIBLE FOOL!!! Your BIBLE BABBLE APOLOGETICS does NOT, I repeat, does NOT eliminate the FACT that Jesus is GOD, and therefore as God, Jesus was an adherent in MURDERING his Jewish creation as explicitly shown AGAIN in the verses below, and where Jesus was an outright ABORTIONIST as well!

A. JESUS SAID: "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death. (Matthew 15: 3-4).

The “command” that Jesus was referring too and that was in effect at His time, and forever to this day, was when Moses said: “Honor your father and mother,' and, 'Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.” (Exodus 21:17)

B. JESUS' WORDS AS GOD TO FOLLOW IF A WIFE IS NOT A VIRGIN UPON MARRIAGE: “But if the thing is true, and evidences of virginity are not found for the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father’s house, AND THE MEN OF HER CITY SHALL STONE HER TO DEATH WITH STONES, because she has done a disgraceful thing in Israel, to play the harlot in her father’s house. So you shall put away the evil from among you.” (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)

C. JESUS AS GOD SHOWS HIMSELF TO BE A BRUTAL ABORTIONIST!!!: “The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for their children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered oh Lord. what should I request for your people? I will ask for the wombs that don’t give birth and breast that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. AND IF THEY GIVE BIRTH, I WILL SLAUGHTER THEIR BELOVED CHILDREN (Hosea 9:11-16)

++++++++++++++++++ RICKEY, to prevent you from making yourself the continued BIBLE FOOL in your posts, seriously, you are outright being SATANICALLY DECEIVING with your answers to hide Jesus and his murdering ways, or you are just ILLITERATE to begin with, therefore, I suggest you take a reading comprehension class herewith to save you from further embarrassment: https://outschool.com/online-classes/reading-comprehension +++++++++++++++++++++

.

RickeyHoltsclaw

21CenturyIconoclast said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

YOUR PATHETIC NON-SENSICAL QUOTE RELATIVE TO JESUS AS GOD!!!: "Jesus is a Jew from the Tribe of Judah via the hypostatic union (Philippians 2:6-11)...He was never "an adherent to murdering His Jewish creation"
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176089/#Comment_176089

WRONG AGAIN BIBLE FOOL!!! Your BIBLE BABBLE APOLOGETICS does NOT, I repeat, does NOT eliminate the FACT that Jesus is GOD, and therefore as God, Jesus was an adherent in MURDERING his Jewish creation as explicitly shown AGAIN in the verses below, and where Jesus was an outright ABORTIONIST as well!

A. JESUS SAID: "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death. (Matthew 15: 3-4).
The “command” that Jesus was referring too and that was in effect at His time, and forever to this day, was when Moses said: “Honor your father and mother,' and, 'Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.” (Exodus 21:17)

B. JESUS' WORDS AS GOD TO FOLLOW IF A WIFE IS NOT A VIRGIN UPON MARRIAGE: “But if the thing is true, and evidences of virginity are not found for the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father’s house, AND THE MEN OF HER CITY SHALL STONE HER TO DEATH WITH STONES, because she has done a disgraceful thing in Israel, to play the harlot in her father’s house. So you shall put away the evil from among you.” (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)

C. JESUS AS GOD SHOWS HIMSELF TO BE A BRUTAL ABORTIONIST!!!: “The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for their children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered oh Lord. what should I request for your people? I will ask for the wombs that don’t give birth and breast that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. AND IF THEY GIVE BIRTH, I WILL SLAUGHTER THEIR BELOVED CHILDREN (Hosea 9:11-16)

++++++++++++++++++ RICKEY, to prevent you from making yourself the continued BIBLE FOOL in your posts, seriously, you are outright being SATANICALLY DECEIVING with your answers to hide Jesus and his murdering ways, or you are just ILLITERATE to begin with, therefore, I suggest you take a reading comprehension class herewith to save you from further embarrassment: https://outschool.com/online-classes/reading-comprehension +++++++++++++++++++++
.

21CenturyIconoclast It is very rude of you to present texts for exegesis requiring such volumes of historical foundation then asking same in threes...I am not your slave...if you desire a response from me...be kind...ask one question at a time...I'm not going to write essays to counter your path to Hell...simply because you're the devil's fool, I'm not yours.

_______________________________________________________

A) You said: A. JESUS SAID: "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death. (Matthew 15: 3-4). The “command” that Jesus was referring too and that was in effect at His time, and forever to this day, was when Moses said: “Honor your father and mother,' and, 'Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.” (Exodus 21:17)

Response to your inquiry:

Jesus said,

(15) 1 Then Pharisees and scribes came to Jesus from Jerusalem and said, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat.” 3 He answered them, “And why do you break the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.’ 5 But you say, ‘If anyone tells his father or his mother, “What you would have gained from me is given to God,”[a] 6 he need not honor his father.’ So for the sake of your tradition you have made void the word[b] of God. 7 You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said:

8 “‘This people honors me with their lips,
but their heart is far from me;
9 in vain do they worship me,
teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’” Matthew 15

First of all, it's very important to understand that Jesus entered the Realm of Time under the Law of Moses and He came to those under that Law...Torah Law; hence, Exodus 21:17.

Jesus used the Law of Moses to point out the hypocrisy of the Pharisees.

Unlike the Pharisees’ accusation which was subtle and indirectly aimed at Jesus’s authority through the actions of His disciples, Jesus goes right after the Pharisees with this question. He accuses them directly and begins His question “Why do you yourselves…” He also lays a more serious charge against the Pharisees. They accused Him of breaking their tradition. He accused them of violating God’s commandment. And at the same time, He also brilliantly dismissed their charge by functionally saying that your tradition is used as an excuse to transgress God’s word.

Jesus then explained to them (and everyone listening) how they abused their tradition to transgress the word of God. He achieves this by citing one of the Ten Commandments. For God commanded, “Honor your father and mother” (Deuteronomy 5:16). Jesus follows up this commandment by quoting the law to emphasize its importance, and “he who speaks evil against Father or Mother is to be put to death” (Exodus 21:17; Leviticus 20:9).

Then Jesus made His charge: But you practice and teach, “Whoever says to his father or mother in their time of need, ‘Whatever I have that would have been able to help you has already been given to God through my gifts to the synagogue. Sorry Father and Mother, I have nothing left give to you that would help you because I am a righteous giver according to the tradition of the elders. The elders’ tradition allowed people to say “The money I would have given to help my parents is the money I gave to the synagogue.” (Jesus does not mention that the money that went to the synagogue also ended up benefiting the elders.)

Jesus is accusing them by saying “You teach and practice that this dishonorable son is excused from honoring the commandment to honor your father and mother in this way.” The elders have provided a work-around, so that people could disobey the Ten Commandments in favor of the tradition of the elders.

Jesus continued His scathing rebuke by branding the Pharisees for what they were—You hypocrites. A hypocrite was the Greek term for an “actor.” This term publicly labeled them as pretenders and moral fakes.

[The Bible Says]

________________________________________________

B. You said: JESUS' WORDS AS GOD TO FOLLOW IF A WIFE IS NOT A VIRGIN UPON MARRIAGE: “But if the thing is true, and evidences of virginity are not found for the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father’s house, AND THE MEN OF HER CITY SHALL STONE HER TO DEATH WITH STONES, because she has done a disgraceful thing in Israel, to play the harlot in her father’s house. So you shall put away the evil from among you.” (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)

Moses described the steps to be taken when a husband falsely accused his wife of not having been a virgin at the time of marriage. He also described what to do if these accusations were true.

Verses 13 – 30 contain cases that concern the marriage relationship. They describe various situations in which marriage is involved. These cases are best understood with their backdrop being the frequent comparison of the LORD’s covenant with Israel and the marriage relationship, which also is a covenant.

Verses 13 – 21 describe the first case. It is presented in the form of a conditional statement (“if,” and “then”) and has two subsections. The first describes the procedures to be followed when a husband wants to get rid of his wife by making false accusations against her (vv. 13-19). The second subsection prescribes the rules to be followed if the accusation leveled against the married woman is true (vv. 20-21).

The situation here was if a man takes a wife and goes in to her and then turns against her, (v. 13). This described a situation where at some time after the consummation of the marriage, the husband began to dislike his wife and wanted to get rid of her. So, in order to preserve his innocence and justify his disposing of his wife, he charges her with shameful deeds and publicly defames her (v. 14).

Moses described the situation as follows:

If a man takes a wife (v. 13)
The husband goes in to her. This of course means that they sexually consummated their marriage.
Then, at some point, the husband turns against her. The phrase turn against is literally “to hate” (Heb. “šānē’”), which can also mean to “reject.”
He charges her with shameful deeds (v. 14). The reference to shameful deeds is literally “deeds of things” in the Hebrew text.
He also publicly defames he The Hebrew reads “brings against her a bad name,” where “name” refers to one’s reputation. The husband here seems intent upon ruining his wife’s reputation and thus justifying his rejection of her.

The shocking statement the man used to publicly defame his wife was I took this woman, but when I came to her, I did not find her a virgin. The phrase came to her is another euphemism for sexual relations.

The accusation was that the husband rightly expected his bride to be a virgin and she was not. In Old Testament times in Israel, a girl would remain in her father’s house and under her father’s care until the day of her wedding ceremony where her father would give her in marriage. But prior to giving his daughter in marriage, the father received a bride-price from the prospective husband at the betrothal ceremony (Genesis 34:12; Exodus 22:15). The money given to the girl’s father was regarded as a form of compensation for the loss of his daughter, a custom still practiced today in some parts of the world.

Since a girl was to remain in her father’s house until she got married, she was expected to remain a virgin to be honored by her husband. Not only was the virginity of the new bride necessary for her honor, it was also important to protect the integrity of the family. In fact, a husband who found out that his wife was not a virgin at the time of marriage could easily expose her and the community would stone her to death for sexual misconduct (vv. 21-23).

Once the accusation was made, the girl’s father and her mother were to take and bring out the evidence of the girl’s virginity to the elders of the city at the gate (v. 15). The gate was the place where civil matters would be taken under consideration by the elders (or rulers) of the city. It was here that the girl’s father shall say to the elders, ‘I gave my daughter to this man for a wife, but he turned against her (v. 16). As seen in v. 13, the Hebrew word translated turned against literally means “to hate.” He was to continue the accusation against his daughter by telling them that the husband has charged her with shameful deeds, saying, “I did not find your daughter a virgin” (v. 17).

To counter this accusation, the parents said that “this is the evidence of my daughter’s virginity.” Then they were to spread the garment before the elders of the city. The garment was that which was used on the wedding night. If there was blood on the garment, this would prove that the woman’s hymen was perforated at that time, proving the woman’s virginity.

The woman’s virginity having been proven, the elders of that city shall take the man (v. 18) and perform the following on the lying husband:

First, they were to chastise him. The Hebrew word for chastise (Heb. “yāsar”) includes the idea of rebuking the person and instructing him concerning the covenant with the LORD.
Second, they shall fine him a hundred shekelsof silver and give it to the girl’s father (v. 19). A hundred shekels of silver is about two and one-half pounds, making it payment of great value. Notice also that the husband was to give it directly to the girl’s father, which would add to the solemn nature of this. The lying husband was to pay this heavy price because he publicly defamed a virgin of Israel. Doing this would also restore the woman’s (and her family’s) honor and integrity within the community.
Finally, she shall remain his wife. Even if the husband wanted to get rid of his wife, the law stipulated that he cannot divorce her all his days. This also protected the sacredness of the marriage relationship. Marriage, like the Mosaic Law, is a covenant, and both needed to be preserved.

Verses 20 – 21 deal with the second part of this case. They specify what was to be done if this charge was true (v. 20), meaning that the girl was not found a virgin, then they were to bring out the girl to the doorway of her father’s house (v. 21). It was here that the men of her city shall stone her to death. In Old Testament times, stoning was the most common form of capital punishment (Leviticus 24:14; Numbers 15:35; Deuteronomy 21:21), because it allowed the community of Israel to actively participate in the process of killing the guilty person.

The idea for this to take place at the doorway of her father’s house was to bring shame and dishonor to her family. The reason for stoning the woman was because she had committed an act of folly in Israel by playing the harlot in her father’s house. The phrase translated as “an act of folly” is used elsewhere in the Bible for sexual misconduct (Genesis 34:7; Judges 20:6). Here, it underscores the immoral action committed by the girl while under her father’s roof. This is further emphasized by the term “harlot,” which, in this context, means “fornication.”

Not only did the woman commit fornication before her marriage, she also deceived her husband and others concerning her virginity. For these reasons, she would get the same punishment as the rebellious son, with the men of the city doing the execution (Deuteronomy 21:21). Doing so would also purge the evil from among Israel. That means that removing the woman from the Israelite community prevented contamination of the community and maintained the purity of the covenant with the LORD.

Some two thousand years later, a devout young Jewish man named Joseph will discover that his betrothed Mary is pregnant prior to the consummation of their marriage. Matthew records that Joseph “being a righteous man and not wanting to disgrace her, planned to send her away secretly” (Matthew 1:19). That Joseph chose not to want to disgrace Mary showed that he was “righteous.” He did not seek to invoke his rights under the law set forth here in Deuteronomy 22:13-21. Rather he sought to benefit Mary, and protect her. Such was the man who was Jesus’s earthly father. Joseph followed the general principle Jesus conveyed concerning divorce. The law of Moses was given due to the hardness of men’s hearts (Matthew 19:8). God’s desire is for justice, mercy, and faith (Matthew 23:23).

Biblical Text

13 “If any man takes a wife and goes in to her and then turns against her, 14 and charges her with shameful deeds and publicly defames her, and says, ‘I took this woman, but when I came near her, I did not find her a virgin,’ 15 then the girl’s father and her mother shall take and bring out the evidence of the girl’s virginity to the elders of the city at the gate. 16 The girl’s father shall say to the elders, ‘I gave my daughter to this man for a wife, but he turned against her; 17 and behold, he has charged her with shameful deeds, saying, “I did not find your daughter a virgin.” But this is the evidence of my daughter’s virginity.’ And they shall spread the garment before the elders of the city. 18 So the elders of that city shall take the man and chastise him, 19 and they shall fine him a hundred shekels of silver and give it to the girl’s father, because he publicly defamed a virgin of Israel. And she shall remain his wife; he cannot divorce her all his days. 20 “But if this charge is true, that the girl was not found a virgin, 21 then they shall bring out the girl to the doorway of her father’s house, and the men of her city shall stone her to death because she has committed an act of folly in Israel by playing the harlot in her father’s house; thus you shall purge the evil from among you.”

[The Bible Says]

__________________________________________________________

C. JESUS AS GOD SHOWS HIMSELF TO BE A BRUTAL ABORTIONIST!!!: “The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for their children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered oh Lord. what should I request for your people? I will ask for the wombs that don’t give birth and breast that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. AND IF THEY GIVE BIRTH, I WILL SLAUGHTER THEIR BELOVED CHILDREN (Hosea 9:11-16)

Response:

Hosea tells Israel that although He was pleased with her in her youth, her disobedience and devotion to Baal worship and its attending culture of exploitation will cause her to go into exile. There she will experience harsh conditions that will result in barrenness and death of her offspring.

This section opens with a divine speech in which the Suzerain (ruler) God reflected upon Israel’s early years as a nation. This reflection shows that Israel had not always appeared so repulsive to God. For, in the beginning of Israel’s history, God saw in her prospects that were quite constructive: I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your forefathers as the earliest fruit on the fig tree in its first season (vs 10).

Grapes that grow in the wilderness or ripe figs in the early part of the summer (first season) give a sense of unexpected pleasure to a weary traveler. Such fruits were so delicate that they were often consumed immediately after picking (Isaiah 28:4, Nahum 3:12). Likewise, Israel was this precious and delicate in God’s eyes in the beginning of her relationship with God. She was valued at first, but indeed was now a failure. So, God’s attitude toward the Israelites changed drastically, because they came to Baal-peor and devoted themselves to shame, and they became as detestable as that which they loved (vs 10).

The reference to Israel going to Baal-peor recalls the time when Israel rebelled against the Suzerain (ruler) God while coming out of Egypt, even before the people got into the land of Canaan. The incident at Baal-peor is recorded in Numbers 25 and is worth citing here. Toward the end of the wilderness wanderings, the Israelites went to the borders of Moab. And while there, “the people began to play the harlot with the daughters of Moab. For they invited the people to the sacrifices of their gods, and the people ate and bowed down to their gods” (Numbers 25:1–2). Consequently, all those who involved themselves in sexual sin and in idol worship with the daughters of Moab died by a plague; 24,000 in total. But those Israelites who remained loyal to God were preserved (Deuteronomy 4:4).

This event was used by Hosea to display Israel’s sinful patterns. She had been unfaithful to God from her earliest history (Deuteronomy 9:7). Like in the days of Moses, Hosea’s generation was defiled because the people devoted themselves to shameful Baal worship and attributed their fertility to involvement in the Baal cult. As at Baal-peor they were engaging in fertility practices with prostitutes (Hosea 9:1, 4:11-12). They also, naturally, have adopted the pagan mindset of exploitation, extraction, deception, and violence (Hosea 4:2).

Therefore, the Suzerain God would judge Israel severely, but appropriately. Since Israel trusted in the fertility god (Baal), the LORD would bring curses on her. God would cause Israel to become infertile: As for Ephraim, their glory will fly away like a bird, no birth, no pregnancy and no conception (vs 11). Israel’s glory is a growing population.

No nation can prosper without a growing population, as a matter of economic reality. This is still true today, but was particularly true in an era when the strength of a nation was measured by the number of soldiers they could muster, and the ability of the nation to produce crops (which was mainly produced by human labor). It is likely that this loss of productivity will be precipitated by the violence and harsh conditions stemming from invasion, occupation, and exile.

Earlier in Hosea, Israel was compared to a “silly dove” fluttering back and forth between Egypt and Assyria, looking for the “best deal” to be protected (Hosea 7:11). Here, Israel’s glory or progeny would depart swiftly like a bird (Prov. 23:5). The people of God would thus lose their glory (that is, their numerous offspring/a growing population) and greatly diminish. There would be no birth, no pregnancy and no conception. Israel would be barren.

The name Ephraim is used specifically here (and in v. 13) likely to heighten the irony since it means “doubly fruitful” or “double fruitfulness” (Genesis 41:52). So, the irony of the situation is that Ephraim, the once doubly fruitful, would become infertile. The people of God would be made fruitless wanderers among the nations.

God would cause Ephraim/Israel to experience death: Though they bring up their children, Yet I will bereave them until not a man is left (vs 12). That means, if Israel were to give birth to any children and were to raise them up, none would survive. This could indicate harsh conditions Israel will encounter while in exile. To set the seal on the threat, the LORD added, Yes, woe to them indeed when I depart from them! (vs 12). God would withdraw His presence from Israel to cause her to experience all kinds of defeat.

This is the same way in which the “wrath of God” is said to be executed on sin in Romans 1; God removed His presence from sinners. He “gave them over” to their own lust, which leads to addiction and eventually to a depraved mind (Romans 1:24,26,28). We all have within us our own source of destruction (James 1:14-15). When God withdraws His hand of protection from Israel, the Assyrian nation in whom they trusted will fully exploit them (Hosea 7:11). Their conditions will be so harsh that they will become barren.

The terrible reversal in Israel’s fortunes is further amplified in the next verse, where Hosea contrasts Israel’s current prosperity with its looming desolation: Ephraim, as I have seen, is planted in a pleasant meadow like Tyre (vs 13). This assessment reminds the reader of the Phoenician city named “Tyre,” a city located on the Mediterranean coast north of Israel (modern-day Lebanon). It was a wealthy city in the early eighth century, allowing the Phoenicians to control most of the commercial activity in the Mediterranean (Ezekiel 28).

In Hosea’s days, Ephraim’s wealth was compared to that of Tyre. It was exceedingly prosperous. But that will not continue: But Ephraim will bring out his children for slaughter (vs 13). An invasion is looming, which will result in mass devastation. That is, Israel, by her sinful and wicked deeds, would leave her children unprotected. This verse seems to allude to the political turbulence of Israel, in which her leaders vacillated between allying with and opposing Assyria, thus leaving their families wide open to the cruelty of the Assyrian army (Hosea 7:11).

For all these reasons, Hosea lamented, Give them, O LORD—what will You give? (vs 14) Through this prayer, the prophet first asked God to give but then seems to express his hesitation, then asks what will you give? Next, the prophet resumed his request and said, Give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts (vs 14). The women’s womb would not hold children. Their breasts would be dry to prevent them from being able to nurse their children. The prophet seems to be saying that it would be an act of mercy to keep the women from bearing children, because of the brutality the nation was about to encounter at the hands of the Assyrians.

Biblical Text

10 I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness;
I saw your forefathers as the earliest fruit on the fig tree in its first season.
But they came to Baal-peor and devoted themselves to shame,
And they became as detestable as that which they loved.
11 As for Ephraim, their glory will fly away like a bird—
No birth, no pregnancy and no conception!
12 Though they bring up their children,
Yet I will bereave them until not a man is left.
Yes, woe to them indeed when I depart from them!
13 Ephraim, as I have seen,
Is planted in a pleasant meadow like Tyre;
But Ephraim will bring out his children for slaughter.
14 Give them, O Lord—what will You give?
Give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts.

[The Bible Says]

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

YOUR BIBLE STUPIDITY THAT HAS NO BOUNDS QUOTE!!!!!!!: "Jesus is a Jew from the Tribe of Judah via the hypostatic union."
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176089/#Comment_176089

Your problem with your Satanic deceiving quotes, is the FACT that you think everyone is as BIBLE INEPT as you are!

JESUS IS NOT FROM THE TRIBE OF JUDAH like your Bible ineptness states, but from the tribe of LEVI as shown in the celestial and incestual VIRGIN BIRTH scenario where his mother Mary was a LEVITE that gave birth to Jesus! Whereas Joseph, Jesus' "Paternal Father," which was from the Davidic blood line as needed to be for Jesus to be the Messiah (Romans 1:3 & Acts 2:30), DID NOT have anything to do with Jesus' birth because Mary's own son Jesus CELESTIALLY impregnated her by his Holy Spirit through godly INCEST from son to mother! What a comedy start for the beginning of Christianity, priceless! GET IT BIBLE FOOL? HUH?

Now, if you want me to BIBLE SLAP YOU SILLY to the point where you will be scraping the proverbial egg from your face for days, then try and tell me that Mary is NOT A LEVITE, where in return, I will show the membership in just how BIBLE INEPT you truly are! UNDERSTOOD BIBLE DUMMY?

.

21CenturyIconoclast

@Factfinder

Are you copy and pasting my statements of biblical FACT to the BIBLE DUNCE "RICKEYHOLTSCLAW" in this thread so you won't be so GAWD DAMNED BIBLE DUMB yourself in the future on said topics, and that is giving Atheism a bad rap? Hopefully you are, and once again, you can thank me later.

YES, if you get out of line with your Bible ineptness, I will correct it as well to help you when you're in Religion Forums like this one!

.

RickeyHoltsclaw

21CenturyIconoclast said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

YOUR BIBLE STUPIDITY THAT HAS NO BOUNDS QUOTE!!!!!!!: "Jesus is a Jew from the Tribe of Judah via the hypostatic union."
https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176089/#Comment_176089

Your problem with your Satanic deceiving quotes, is the FACT that you think everyone is as BIBLE INEPT as you are!

JESUS IS NOT FROM THE TRIBE OF JUDAH like your Bible ineptness states, but from the tribe of LEVI as shown in the celestial and incestual VIRGIN BIRTH where his mother Mary was a LEVITE that gave birth to Jesus! Whereas, Joseph, Jesus' "Paternal Father," which was from the Davidic blood line as needed to be for Jesus to be the Messiah (Romans 1:3 & Acts 2:30), DID NOT have anything to do with Jesus' birth because Mary's own son Jesus CELESTIALLY impregnated her by his Holy Spirit through godly INCEST from son to mother! What a comedy start for the beginning of Christianity, priceless! GET IT BIBLE FOOL? HUH?

Now, if you want me to BIBLE SLAP YOU SILLY to the point where you will be scraping the proverbial egg from your face for days, then try and tell me that Mary is NOT A LEVITE, where in return, I will show the membership in just how BIBLE INEPT you truly are! UNDERSTOOD BIBLE DUMMY?

.

@21CenturyIconoclast ; Jesus is a descendant of Judah through David...

The Genealogy of Jesus Christ

The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

2 Abraham was the father of Isaac, and Isaac the father of Jacob, and Jacob the father of Judah and his brothers, 3 and Judah the father of Perez and Zerah by Tamar, and Perez the father of Hezron, and Hezron the father of Ram,1 4 and Ram the father of Amminadab, and Amminadab the father of Nahshon, and Nahshon the father of Salmon, 5 and Salmon the father of Boaz by hRahab, and Boaz the father of Obed by Ruth, and Obed the father of Jesse, 6 and Jesse the father of David the king. Matthew 1

5 And one of the elders said to me, “Weep no more; behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” Revelation 5:5

Jeremiah 23:5-6

“Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will raise up for David a righteous Branch, and he shall reign as king and deal wisely, and shall execute justice and righteousness in the land. In his days Judah will be saved, and Israel will dwell securely. And this is the name by which he will be called: ‘The Lord is our righteousness.’

Hebrews 7:14

For it is evident that our Lord was descended from Judah, and in connection with that tribe Moses said nothing about priests.

Revelation 5:1-14

Then I saw in the right hand of him who was seated on the throne a scroll written within and on the back, sealed with seven seals. And I saw a mighty angel proclaiming with a loud voice, “Who is worthy to open the scroll and break its seals?” And no one in heaven or on earth or under the earth was able to open the scroll or to look into it, and I began to weep loudly because no one was found worthy to open the scroll or to look into it. And one of the elders said to me, “Weep no more; behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” ...

Genesis 49:10

The scepter shall not depart from Judah, nor the ruler's staff from between his feet, until tribute comes to him; and to him shall be the obedience of the peoples.

Deuteronomy 33:7

And this he said of Judah: “Hear, O Lord, the voice of Judah, and bring him in to his people. With your hands contend for him, and be a help against his adversaries.”

Factfinder

@21CenturyIconoclast

Yes I see all your failures. You're really b*tt hurt bad over your humiliated loss. Stalking me just because I proved beyond a doubt, defeated every verse you put up. You feel so you haven't typed your boneheaded statement again because you know there are non jew TRUE Christians all around the world. You might even meet a few if you ever left your mommy's basement.

"Biblically, the ONLY people that can be Christians are HEBREWS, period!" Says the 21clown fool. One of a plethora of verses debunks your garbage because you don't get the literal context of the literal verses that your mommy read to you. Literally, what does 'whosoever' mean?

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Embarrass yourself all you want. Ps. Ricky is winning his debate with you, and you know it.

Barnardot

@21CenturyIconoclast @Factfinder ;YES, if you get out of line with your Bible ineptness, I will correct it as well to help you when you're in Religion Forums like this one!

Well I can see a paradox going on there so I just had to jump in and point out a point.

You see if some one is inept at the Bible it proberly means that they have there heads screwed on right in the first place since the Bible is so full of never ending crap and fallicies its not even funny. So if some one is inept about the Bible it makes no difference since the Bible is the biggest heap of dog doodoo ever to go in to print.

And your got to realize that the Religion Forum is for people to express there ideas and reveal facts about how opressive and disgusting and bigoted and anti social religion is. It certainly isn't for people to jump on a soap box to push even more dishonest guilt tripping lieing morbid crap. In fact I think that religious people should be sentsored from making there dum comments in this forum because they cant even think rationally and debate properly any way.

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

YOUR QUOTE RELATIVE TO JESUS SAYING THAT ANY OFFSPRING THAT CURSE THEIR PARENTS IS TO BE MURDERED!!!: “He accused them of violating God’s commandment. And at the same time, He also brilliantly dismissed their charge by functionally saying that your tradition is used as an excuse to transgress God’s word.” https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176098/#Comment_176098

YES! The Pharisees did VIOLATE Gods word that Jesus was referring to in the following passage: “Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death. Because they have cursed their father or mother, their blood will be on their own head.” (Leviticus 20:9)

Therefore, God’s word, which is Jesus’ word as God, still says that a parents offspring that curse them are to be put to death, and their blood shall be upon them! Thank you for giving credence to this Bible FACT, therefore, have you had to MURDER any of your offspring that cursed you?

YOUR SHORT ANSWER IS:

YOUR FINAL QUOTE TO YOUR “WAR AND PEACE” DISSERTATION THAT WAS NEEDLESS TO SAY THE LEAST, RELATIVE TO MURDERING A WIFE THAT WAS NOT A VIRGIN AT MARRIAGE: “God’s desire is for justice, mercy, and faith (Matthew 23:23)”

YES, Jesus in being God, desired JUSTICE to be followed in MURDERING a wife that is not a virgin upon her wedding night! We thank you for admitting to this JUSTICE in your once again “War and Peace Apologetic Book Dissertation!"

“But if the thing is true, and evidences of virginity are not found for the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father’s house, and the men of her city shall stone her to death with stones, because she has done a disgraceful thing in Israel, to play the harlot in her father’s house. So you shall put away the evil from among you.” (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)

An image of Christianity's disgusting MORAL BIBLICAL VALUES that the pseudo-christian has to follow in the 21st Century relative to the revealing murdering Bible passage of Deuteronomy 22:13-21!!! https://www.imagebam.com/view/MESAVLS

YOUR SHORT ANSWER IS:

JESUS AS GOD IN BEING AN OUTRIGHT ABORTIONIST IN HOSEA 9:11-16!!!!

With all of your BIBLE BABBLE “War and Peace” dissertation AGAIN from your Satanic “Apologetic Books,” relative to Hosea 9:11-16, THE FACT REMAINS THAT JESUS AS GOD ABORTED the offspring of the women of Ephraim in the passage below, AND, SLAUGHTERED their beloved children if they gave birth to them, period!

“The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for their children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered oh Lord. what should I request for your people? I will ask for the wombs that don’t give birth and breast that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. AND IF THEY GIVE BIRTH, I WILL SLAUGHTER THEIR BELOVED CHILDREN (Hosea 9:11-16)

YOUR SHORT ANSWER IS:

OKAY, HEADS UP!!! Who wants to join Christianity where their God JESUS promoted the MURDERING of a parents offspring that curse them, AND, where Jesus' inspired words state that if a wife is not a virgin upon their wedding night, they are to be MURDERED, AND, where Jesus as God was an outfight ABORTIONIST where he would SLAUGHTER any baby that was born as shown in the Hosea passage?

ANYONE? COME ON, DON'T BE "SICKENED" BY BIBLE FACTS SHOWN ABOVE, JOIN THE CHRISTIAN FAITH ANYWAY! LOL!!!

.

21CenturyIconoclast

@RickeyHoltsclaw

YOUR "BIBLE DUNCERY" IS LIKE "FACTFINDERS," WHERE YOU ASSUME THAT JESUS IS FROM THE LINE OF DAVID, NOT!!!!!!!: "Jesus is a descendant of Judah through David... The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham" https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176101/#Comment_176101

SERIOUSLY, ARE YOU AND "THE BIBLE DUNCE "FACTFINDER" FAMILY MEMBERS WHERE YOU HAVE SPREAD YOUR "STUPIDITY GENE TOGETHER?" The both of you do not have the sense to feel totally embarrassed over your BLATANT Bible mindedness!!!

I am going to make this real simple for you to hopefully grasp quickly, like I had to do with the BIBLE DUNCE FACTFINDER, okay?

1. Jesus’ mother Mary was a LEVITE: Mary was the cousin of Elizabeth who is the descendent of Aaron, therefore placing MARY in the tribe of LEVI: “And behold, Elizabeth, your relative, has also conceived* a son in her old age, and this is the sixth month for her who was called barren; for nothing will be impossible for God.” MARY SAID; “Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord. May it be done to me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her. (Luke 1:36-38)

2. Jesus’ Step-Father Joseph, was from the blood line of David: "So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David." (Luke 2:4)

Simply put, according to the prophecies in the Old Testament, Jesus IS NOT from the blood line of David as shown in proposition number one and two above because Paul substantiates this biblical axiom herewith: “Jesus the Messiah, our Lord, who was descended from David ACCORDING TO THE FLESH” (Romans 1:3).

GET IT YET? Barring the fact that Paul was WRONG in the Romans 1:3 verse above (as I can explain historically if need be), Jesus can only be from the blood line of David “FROM THE FLESH!” And since Jesus’ mother MARY was a LEVITE, and Joseph was NOT engaged in impregnating MARY, where Jesus in being the son of MARY through his Holy Spirit, impregnated his own mother MARY through godly INCEST! Therefore, Jesus blood line is from the house of LEVI because Mary was a LEVITE as shown in proposition number one!!!!

Now, if you want to be made the Bible and history FOOL any further upon this topic, then proceed where again I will BIBLE SLAP YOU SILLY like I had to do with the equally DUMBFOUNDED of the Bible, FACTFINDER!!!

.

Factfinder

@Barnardot

I agree with you 100% At the end of the day it's all nonsense where the bible is concerned. 21Centurylconoclast holds Byzantine views as an atheist though!!! I had to mess with that, couldn't help it. LOL

MayCaesar

I would like to pay everyone's attention to the fact that not a single Christian in this discussion has answered the question the OP asked. That is pretty characteristic of the heavily religious crowd: avoiding direct questions and dancing around issues with their faith is a prerequisite to having that faith in the first place.

Factfinder

@MayCaesar

They have obfuscated in their usual ways though. Claiming their god wouldn't give such a command. Despite their book telling them to kill when commanded. Even jesus said to make swords...

MayCaesar

@Factfinder

I mean, "god would not order me this", even if it was true, still does not address the question. What is being asked if, in the alternative Universe, with everything else being the same except god being able to order this, he did. They simply refuse to consider this scenario, because they know that there is no answer that will make them simultaneously look like a decent human being, and not break their faith.

I think @ZeusAres42 is right: these beliefs rest on insincerity. It is impossible to both be intellectually honest, and not make an argument that will make one's faith look bad.

In secular philosophy, no consideration is out of the question. You can ask me something very nasty - "If you were a guard at Auschwitz, would you refuse your orders?" - and, knowing human psychology somewhat well, I would honestly say, "Probably not". That I would never be a guard at Auschwitz is not relevant to the question.
But in religion, there is this idea of "sacredness", where some considerations are viewed as transgressions against the divine order. In essence, critical thinking is to be limited, because some critical thoughts are too heretic to even be thought.

Factfinder

@MayCaesar

You're right. It's like they believe as a safety net, just in case. If I can miss hell why not? But when it comes to practicing their faith, (do unto others...) we don't see that. Nope we get self righteous judgments and hubris assertions on atheist views.

MayCaesar

@Factfinder

The core premise of how the divine judgement is supposed to work has never made much sense to me. In the Pathfinder universe, goddess Pharasma enacted judgement on the souls of the dead based on their deeds, not their beliefs. You can believe whatever you want, but what has impact on this world is your actions, not the content of your mind. Not that I like the idea of living in a world working like this, but this, at least, seems just. But in Christianity, Islam and most other monotheistic religions where you go depends on your allegiance. If you believe in the Christian god, then you can get away with doing fairly evil deeds - your faith was strong, so you will end up in Heaven. On the other hand, all non-believers, even the most benevolent and charitable ones, should go to Hell because they did not bow enough to the divine dictator.

It just seems insane to me to assume that a god with such insecurities would be able to create the world. Sounds like he would need a councilor.

Factfinder

MayCaesar said:

@Factfinder

The core premise of how the divine judgement is supposed to work has never made much sense to me. In the Pathfinder universe, goddess Pharasma enacted judgement on the souls of the dead based on their deeds, not their beliefs. You can believe whatever you want, but what has impact on this world is your actions, not the content of your mind. Not that I like the idea of living in a world working like this, but this, at least, seems just. But in Christianity, Islam and most other monotheistic religions where you go depends on your allegiance. If you believe in the Christian god, then you can get away with doing fairly evil deeds - your faith was strong, so you will end up in Heaven. On the other hand, all non-believers, even the most benevolent and charitable ones, should go to Hell because they did not bow enough to the divine dictator.

It just seems insane to me to assume that a god with such insecurities would be able to create the world. Sounds like he would need a councilor.

Yeah, that's one of the benefits of not being brought up in an environment where it's 'expected' to be religious. You have the opportunity to start out with a clear head. We have 'in god we trust' on our money, the movies for decades promogulated religious views. Even though my parents didn't attend church they still professed faith and happily sent us kids to church with grandma. Masterful manipulation yet evil if you think about it. Believe me I often wondered how I fell for it once I began rejecting it.

MayCaesar

@Factfinder

We are all prone to conditioning like this. I was lucky with respect to religion as my parents always taught me to think critically (my father started having discussions with me on Socrates when I was 7, for instance), and as they let me play video games since before I could walk (PCs in the early 90-s in Russia were very uncommon, so I was quite privileged). I very quickly learned that adults often intentionally confused virtual/fictional stories with real ones in order to deceive kids, as well as (as I learned later) each other. I had my suspicions, and when at the age of 4 I saw that "Santa Claus" was my uncle wearing a funny suit, I thought, "I see, you guys think that I am that dense. Nice try!" So when my grandmother tried to explain Christianity to me when I was 6, I was already used to this stuff and thought, "Ah, this is just another Santa story. Boring". And that was it.

However, as everyone around me (except for my parents) was talking about how great Russia was, despite my early developed critical thinking, some of it went through. I remember having this conversation with my dad when I was, I think, 14, asking him, "I understand that Russia right now is in a terrible state, and the Soviet Union was a horrible state as well - but was Russia not one of the most prosperous countries in the world, at least, in the early 20-th century?" His smirk told me that this, too, is something I was lied about (and he is very rarely wrong about these things). By the time I was 16 or so, I had done enough research to understand that Russian history was not what everyone told me it was.

Sometimes the most obvious things are the most obscured ones. Humans have the uncanny tendency to put soft lies before hard truths. Realizing this, fully internalizing this and learning to correct for this is one of the most important steps in anyone's self-development.

Barnardot

@Factfinder @21CenturyIconoclast ;Byzantine views as an atheist though!!!

Well maybe he does take that drug and Ive heard that its pretty wicked. But you raised a good point there. I have suspected for a long time that not only do most people who call them selves religious not even believe in God but most of the people who do say they believe in God and spout there mouths off about it are really atheists and use religion to control others since there no more than control freaks who got beaten up by there dads and didnt get there moms breast milk. All the others who say theres a God and are not control freak atheists all live in special places where they get given controlled doses of Byzantine every day.

RickeyHoltsclaw

21CenturyIconoclast said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

YOUR "BIBLE DUNCERY" IS LIKE "FACTFINDERS," WHERE YOU ASSUME THAT JESUS IS FROM THE LINE OF DAVID, NOT!!!!!!!: "Jesus is a descendant of Judah through David... The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham" https://www.debateisland.com/discussion/comment/176101/#Comment_176101

SERIOUSLY, ARE YOU AND "THE BIBLE DUNCE "FACTFINDER" FAMILY MEMBERS WHERE YOU HAVE SPREAD YOUR "STUPIDITY GENE TOGETHER?" The both of you do not have the sense to feel totally embarrassed over your BLATANT Bible mindedness!!!

I am going to make this real simple for you to hopefully grasp quickly, like I had to do with the BIBLE DUNCE FACTFINDER, okay?

1. Jesus’ mother Mary was a LEVITE: Mary was the cousin of Elizabeth who is the descendent of Aaron, therefore placing MARY in the tribe of LEVI: “And behold, Elizabeth, your relative, has also conceived* a son in her old age, and this is the sixth month for her who was called barren; for nothing will be impossible for God.” MARY SAID; “Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord. May it be done to me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her. (Luke 1:36-38)

2. Jesus’ Step-Father Joseph, was from the blood line of David: "So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David." (Luke 2:4)

Simply put, according to the prophecies in the Old Testament, Jesus IS NOT from the blood line of David as shown in proposition number one and two above because Paul substantiates this biblical axiom herewith: “Jesus the Messiah, our Lord, who was descended from David ACCORDING TO THE FLESH” (Romans 1:3).
GET IT YET? Barring the fact that Paul was WRONG in the Romans 1:3 verse above (as I can explain historically if need be), Jesus can only be from the blood line of David “FROM THE FLESH!” And since Jesus’ mother MARY was a LEVITE, and Joseph was NOT engaged in impregnating MARY, where Jesus in being the son of MARY through his Holy Spirit, impregnated his own mother MARY through godly INCEST! Therefore, Jesus blood line is from the house of LEVI because Mary was a LEVITE as shown in proposition number one!!!!

Now, if you want to be made the Bible and history FOOL any further upon this topic, then proceed where again I will BIBLE SLAP YOU SILLY like I had to do with the equally DUMBFOUNDED of the Bible, FACTFINDER!!!
.

@21CenturyIconoclast

1) This is the genealogy of Messiah through Mary via Heli as per Luke's Gosple, Chapter 3; v. 30 tells you that Messiah is from the Tribe of Juda via David.

23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,

24 Which was the son of Matthat, which was the son of Levi, which was the son of Melchi, which was the son of Janna, which was the son of Joseph,

25 Which was the son of Mattathias, which was the son of Amos, which was the son of Naum, which was the son of Esli, which was the son of Nagge,

26 Which was the son of Maath, which was the son of Mattathias, which was the son of Semei, which was the son of Joseph, which was the son of Juda,

27 Which was the son of Joanna, which was the son of Rhesa, which was the son of Zorobabel, which was the son of Salathiel, which was the son of Neri,

28 Which was the son of Melchi, which was the son of Addi, which was the son of Cosam, which was the son of Elmodam, which was the son of Er,

29 Which was the son of Jose, which was the son of Eliezer, which was the son of Jorim, which was the son of Matthat, which was the son of Levi,

30 Which was the son of Simeon, which was the son of Juda, which was the son of Joseph, which was the son of Jonan, which was the son of Eliakim,

31 Which was the son of Melea, which was the son of Menan, which was the son of Mattatha, which was the son of Nathan, which was the son of David,

32 Which was the son of Jesse, which was the son of Obed, which was the son of Booz, which was the son of Salmon, which was the son of Naasson,

33 Which was the son of Aminadab, which was the son of Aram, which was the son of Esrom, which was the son of Phares, which was the son of Juda,

34 Which was the son of Jacob, which was the son of Isaac, which was the son of Abraham, which was the son of Thara, which was the son of Nachor,

35 Which was the son of Saruch, which was the son of Ragau, which was the son of Phalec, which was the son of Heber, which was the son of Sala,

36 Which was the son of Cainan, which was the son of Arphaxad, which was the son of Sem, which was the son of Noe, which was the son of Lamech,

37 Which was the son of Mathusala, which was the son of Enoch, which was the son of Jared, which was the son of Maleleel, which was the son of Cainan,

38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

______________________________________________

2) Matthew's Gospel provides you Messiah's genealogy through Joseph; Jesus is from the Tribe of Judah through David.

1 The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

2 Abraham was the father of Isaac, and Isaac the father of Jacob, and Jacob the father of Judah and his brothers, 3 and Judah the father of Perez and Zerah by Tamar, and Perez the father of Hezron, and Hezron the father of Ram,[a] 4 and Ram the father of Amminadab, and Amminadab the father of Nahshon, and Nahshon the father of Salmon, 5 and Salmon the father of Boaz by Rahab, and Boaz the father of Obed by Ruth, and Obed the father of Jesse, 6 and Jesse the father of David the king.

And David was the father of Solomon by the wife of Uriah, 7 and Solomon the father of Rehoboam, and Rehoboam the father of Abijah, and Abijah the father of Asaph,[b] 8 and Asaph the father of Jehoshaphat, and Jehoshaphat the father of Joram, and Joram the father of Uzziah, 9 and Uzziah the father of Jotham, and Jotham the father of Ahaz, and Ahaz the father of Hezekiah, 10 and Hezekiah the father of Manasseh, and Manasseh the father of Amos,[c] and Amos the father of Josiah, 11 and Josiah the father of Jechoniah and his brothers, at the time of the deportation to Babylon.

12 And after the deportation to Babylon: Jechoniah was the father of Shealtiel,[d] and Shealtiel the father of Zerubbabel, 13 and Zerubbabel the father of Abiud, and Abiud the father of Eliakim, and Eliakim the father of Azor, 14 and Azor the father of Zadok, and Zadok the father of Achim, and Achim the father of Eliud, 15 and Eliud the father of Eleazar, and Eleazar the father of Matthan, and Matthan the father of Jacob, 16 and Jacob the father of Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom Jesus was born, who is called Christ.

17 So all the generations from Abraham to David were fourteen generations, and from David to the deportation to Babylon fourteen generations, and from the deportation to Babylon to the Christ fourteen generations.

___________________________________________

3) Jesus is from the blood-line of David.

Matthew 1:1 ESV / 13 helpful votes

The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

Romans 1:3 ESV / 11 helpful votes

Concerning his Son, who was descended from David according to the flesh

Luke 1:32 ESV / 10 helpful votes

He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. And the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David,

Matthew 9:27 ESV / 8 helpful votes

And as Jesus passed on from there, two blind men followed him, crying aloud, “Have mercy on us, Son of David.”

Matthew 22:42 ESV / 6 helpful votes

Saying, “What do you think about the Christ? Whose son is he?” They said to him, “The son of David.”

Matthew 12:23 ESV / 5 helpful votes

And all the people were amazed, and said, “Can this be the Son of David?”

Ezekiel 37:23-26 ESV / 5 helpful votes

They shall not defile themselves anymore with their idols and their detestable things, or with any of their transgressions. But I will save them from all the backslidings in which they have sinned, and will cleanse them; and they shall be my people, and I will be their God. “My servant David shall be king over them, and they shall all have one shepherd. They shall walk in my rules and be careful to obey my statutes. They shall dwell in the land that I gave to my servant Jacob, where your fathers lived. They and their children and their children's children shall dwell there forever, and David my servant shall be their prince forever. I will make a covenant of peace with them. It shall be an everlasting covenant with them. And I will set them in their land and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in their midst forevermore.

John 7:42 ESV / 4 helpful votes

Has not the Scripture said that the Christ comes from the offspring of David, and comes from Bethlehem, the village where David was?”

Matthew 21:9 ESV / 4 helpful votes

And the crowds that went before him and that followed him were shouting, “Hosanna to the Son of David! Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord! Hosanna in the highest!”

Matthew 21:9 ESV / 4 helpful votes

And the crowds that went before him and that followed him were shouting, “Hosanna to the Son of David! Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord! Hosanna in the highest!”

Mark 10:47-48 ESV / 3 helpful votes

And when he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to cry out and say, “Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!” And many rebuked him, telling him to be silent. But he cried out all the more, “Son of David, have mercy on me!”

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